Sounds good.

Doug

Joe,
Here's a situation I do not want to be in;
lets say I release what will be at best partial data and someone invests heavily in 100 trees based on what they think my data says and I find much better varieties then what the early partial data suggests.
Now as after 10 years of doing this I nail down some great new (perhaps just new to me) varieties and plant them in my orchard and this other 100 tree orchard fellow sees that I have not planted a single tree of the variety he invested in. He then draws the conclusion I sent him down the wrong path to handicap my competition (even though there is no way you could produce more great figs here then you could sell.) and he becomes very unhappy.
The problem with raw data is, like statistics, it is easy to misunderstand what you are reading.

I do not want to take responsibility for anyone getting into an unwanted situation. The 400 tree orchard near me had years of zero production after 2 very cold winters damaged the 3 varieties they chose to plant. There just isn't anything more important then finding a variety that will be dependable, productive and cold hardy. I have been collecting cold hardy varieties as no matter how good a fig tastes it just won't work in a planted orchard if it can't weather the cold.

One other thing to add;
as there is virtually zero data out there about the best varieties to plant -- I worry that folks give way too much credit to those of us with large collections. If I were planning a fig orchard from scratch and had little experience with figs I don't know where I'd turn. Va Tech, our land grant university has virtually zero fig info and there are no other real places to turn. So if this person then came upon a person like me who has been trying to solve this issue I'm afraid that person would (due to few other choices) turn to whatever info I've released and and give it more weight then it deserves. I am not an expert and do not want to be responsible for others who haven't done their homework -- and not because they didn't want to but because there was no place to turn. There are just no reference materials out there - no growing figs for dummies even so in this vacuum anything sent out into the ether becomes far more important then it may have a right to be.

Michael -- 

It's OK, please don't sweat it.  

Personally, I'm just a hobbyist.  Re advice, I'm more in the "caveat emptor" camp; but you are clearly a much more compassionate person than me.  Nevertheless, I can't and won't criticize.  Meanwhile, if I have to try 15 different Mt Etnas and 8 different Adriatics just to figure out which is the best to grow here, that'll be my cross to bear. :)

FYI, Ronde de Bordeaux (in-ground with protection) is early, productive, and tasty here (Z6B).

Michael, is so right about the fig data one might find on the Internet.

One must do ones own investigating if you are planning on investing in a large fig orchard. The best you can get from those of us who are growing figs outside, in cold parts of the country, are cultivars to investigate. Not make a final decision on what to plant based on information we might post.

There simply is no definitive material out there on figs in cold areas. Plus, each location can be so very different. A fig that grows well in one location can be a total disaster grown just 6 miles away.

My testing is now going on 12 years or so, and we are still trying to find a fig, that is the best for us, as close as possible for our location. But, what was good two years ago, can be a total bust two years later.

As of this moment I like Hanc's English Brown Turkey, LaRadek's English Brown Turkey, and Florea, for our zone 5b/6a area of Connecticut. Last winter got down to minus 10 degrees Fahrenheit, and both Hardy Hartford, and Marseilles Black vs, were able to keep wood alive at a height or 8"and 12", with out any type of winter protection. Which is acceptable for us, since we prune our figs any way down to around 24", each fall.

JOE D, You appear to be in a growing zone 6b, in Rhode Island. So, you might want to investigate the above five figs. After they have become mature, they may work for you.

This is my first posting after being out sick for the last two years. So, I'm running way behind on filling orders for plants. But hope to be able to start filling back orders sometime later this fall. 

A tentative report of what we have grown and testing here 10 years or so, is available. But, it is also two years late in being edited.

If any one wants to read it, send a request directly to me at: robertcharper@gmail.com

Bob Harper 

I've done a bit of research on this forum to find what experience growers in my or similar climates consider their best figs. The interesting thing is that a variety which they might have posted as their WOW fig in say 2013 doesn't even get a mention a couple of years later. Is it because it's no longer "new" to them, their tastes in figs changes, fig quality not consistent, better varieties found, etc.? There are a lot of variables here.

Conrad,
There is one more reason and its ugly.
There was a group on here -- gone now (mostly) that used to hype certain figs so they could sell on Ebay for absurd amounts of money and it worked. Ex. Lebanese Red, Maltese Falcon, Maltese Beauty, etc. One it did not work on was MaCool.
These guys bragged about how huge their collections were and did whatever they could to impress - mainly the newbies - and then they overcharged for what I call the "fad figs" which as far as I can tell are not the super figs they claimed. I have them all and frankly I'm not impressed -- but I will give them the 5 years I give every variety to prove itself.

I wish the newbies would stop chasing what they think are the most wanted varieties. Next year it will be different varieties and this year's will be almost forgotten. These fad figs are rarely tested and many are sold by folks who aren't growing them. The very first to get them have great trade bait and can make very good money, but everyone else is just over paying.
Newbies need to learn to build their collections with good solid varieties that have been tested and grown by many and found to be solid. There are, many times, better figs but there just isn't any way to make the big money selling them. Varieties like Negronne (VdB), LSU Gold and Battaglia Green, etc.
I sell varieties I grow and have produced figs from and varieties I think are good. If I'm selling it I have experience with it and think it is worth the 5 years it takes to find out if it's good for you or not. I'm not trying to blow my own horn but a lot of figs on Ebay are ones someone just found in a parking lot and gave it a new name and got help hyping it. Ok -- yep I'm venting a bit but every year I throw out varieties that were fad figs 5 years before and just have not turned out to be any better then the good old standards and in many cases they are inferior.
Remember that the figs Pons thinks are great and folks pay $500 for a cutting for may not be any good at all grown in say Virginia. Try and buy figs from someone in the same type of growing environment as yours and ask them for recommendations.
I do not know of a single example of an over $200 variety that has proven to be an excellent fig. The closest would be Ronde de Bordeaux as it was a very popular fig a few years ago - but was never really super expensive - and has proven --in my collection -- to be superb, but a friend of mine in Florida is not impressed at all.
Also at some point you have to decide if you are a fig grower interested in producing excellent figs or a baseball card collector just interested in getting whatever you don't have.

Newbie here.  I just like growing stuff...the more the merrier.  If I can get a Shinning Star fig within my budget I would.  And, yes, I've used the analogy of card collecting when I have to explain why I have so many fig plants.  I see through the eyes of a hobby gardener as opposed to the eyes of a businessman.  Both have their place.

I'm stopping at 100 trees.
I already have doubles and triples of proven favorites.
vdb, rdb, meade, red libya and a couple others.
Time will tell how many varieties will be worth keeping to me.
I like to have 3 vdb all producing at the same time.

Doug

Michael - I have to respectfully disagree with you on one point - you are an expert, relatively speaking.  Compared to those with less time involved, or with less of an inquisitive mind, or with less varieties to learn from and, maybe most importantly, compared with others in your region, you are an expert, since there are no others with the info you have gleaned.  You said it yourself - even the agricultural experts at VaTech do not know or understand figs ( like you do ).  Just like I consider Dennis an expert and Herman2 an expert.  People with information they have learned thru experience and study.

We appreciate those who are willing to share that info to help the rest of us along.  None of us expect you to know everything, but what you share is so important to those of us a few years behind you in experience.

Thanks !!!

Michael...don't try to change what can't be changed, $$$$ and bragging rights trumps all. I sometimes get hooked on the newest, rarest, super rare but I have a maximum that I will pay. I have so many Smiths, CdD B,N & G, RdB, VdB, BMadeira, Violete Sollies, JH Adriatic, Damatie, VS, MBVS, LSU S BLack, other LSU, St Rita, Meade, B Green .... etc...very reasonably priced varieties that work well for me. Sometimes I get caught up in the hype but I have a limit and I am willing to wait until the "hypers" lose interest and find a newer hype. Then the old hype is priced within reason. Do not forget, all the figs that I previously mentioned were expensive at one time. Sometimes its tough to even get a bid on CdD Blanc...can you imagine? Anyways I am 100...well maybe 99% behind everything that you have said Michael....but some things just can't be changed...it's no fault of those who try...it is what it is. JUST KEEP TRYING TO HELP OUT THE NEWBIES, THEY NEED SOMEONE LIKE YOU TO STEER THEM IN LOGICAL DIRECTION, someone who cares about them and not their $$$$$. Those who care about newbies will set them up with information that they need to be successful and offer cuttings and plants at a reasonable price to get them going. Hang in there.

Fern Forest HI, 96771 (Zone 12a)

Best 5 this last year, tasted 54 total. I had at least 200 figs of each to judge them from.

1. Figo Preto (60-100) grams (15 trees) & 200+ more rooting.

Best productivity, best flavor, best looking, very consistent flavor quality. Long picking time, if you pick it a day or two early it's still very flavorful. Berry/tropical fruit aftertaste: Mango and banana is what I tasted most strongly.

2. Grise Olivette (70-100+) grams (40 trees)

On the outside this fig is not going to win any beauty contests. Tan, brown, reddish brown. Grise is just a fancy French word for brown. Very large, syrupy, unique texture, marshmallow strings, a nice mix of sugar, berry and honey flavors.

3. Napolitana Negra (70-100+) grams (40 trees)

Very productive, vigorous growing, large black mission-like figs. The other three mission types I grow have lower production and smaller figs.
Typical mission type fig flavor.

4. Violet De Bordeaux (40-60) grams (50 trees)

Realiable & Workhorse are the words that best describes this fig. Figs ripen on nearly ever node. Figs are all close to the same size and flavor is realiably good. Fruits continuously until they go dormant in January. Resin berry flavor.

5. LSU Hollier (40-70) grams (80 trees)
Green figs, red interior. Dryer weather is better for these. Among the top in flavor, if they don't get wet when ripening. Sugar berry flavor, very sweet.

This thread is very valuable a lot of important information was discussed , necessary
for a newbie like me, thank you very much.

Geeez Ed, Where do I send your check!! Seriously I do appreciate the comments.
Wayne, Don't get me wrong I was the same newbie I referenced. I chased the fad figs just like everyone else. 
Figgysid, Do you by any chance have Black Madeira to compare with your Preto?

@mgginva: Nope. The numerous times people mentioned in threads, that U.C. Davis Black Maderia was very infected with FMV, made me avoid it.

I'm looking for healthy trees for commercial fruit production. I double sourced my Preto instead. Both sources produced very healthy, vigorous, productive trees.

I also have and read Bob Harpers report. Some really great information there. Anyone in zone six or lower should contact Bob for a copy. A must read. Glad to see you well enough to post again Bob, hopefully we here more from you going forward.

figgysid1,
I think just about anything that comes out of UCD is badly infected with fmv. I went through over a dozen Black Ischias before I found one that is now doing well and producing great figs.
I am comparing Black Madeira to Preto as they both produce great fruit. One of my Black Madeiras is doing very well. 

I am also looking for the same thing, i.e. I want to produce figs commercially on a scale of about 200 - 250 trees (to begin with) along with another orchard for trialling "new" varieties.

After 10+ years of experimenting with different varieties I have pinned down only a handful of varieties that I absolutely want to build my orchard around.
My goal is to find 25 varieties that will produce quality fruit here in Zone 7.

Last year I moved and was also in a serious accident so my crop was vastly reduced but the year before all my fruit went to The Inn at Little Washington - arguably the best eatery - within 250 miles. They were thrilled with my figs and sent someone to my property 3x per week to collect figs.
I made a deal with them - I'd sell them all my crop for $9 per pound and label each variety and in return the chefs would rate the figs they liked and disliked the most.
This information was valuable because it helped reinforce other tastings I've done.

As time goes by that 25 variety goal may end up being reduced to 15.

There is a local orchard of about 400 trees but they grow Mission, Champagne and something that looks just like the other two so they have 3 larger honey type figs. After 2 hard winters they produced no figs at all as these are not appropriate varieties for this area. Seeing the disaster which is their orchard is just more fuel added to the fire - the right varieties need to be located if the project is to ever pay for itself.
I have grown a lot of different fruits and figs are easily the most dependent on proper variety ID as there is no help from the extension folks.
Do you grow Ronde de Bordeaux?
thx,
mgg

Thanks Michael, please keep us updated on your project and comparisons.

@mgginva: I have 20 RDB but I am waiting for the fruit to ripen, any day now.. If it's good I was going to up it to 100 trees. They are healthy, vigorous trees, are loaded with figs and have a tight eye as well.

I have a few others that are growing well and loaded with figs. I have not tasted these 3 yet. But they should have ripe figs soon. > 3 weeks estimate.

Raspberry Latte (25 trees)
JH Adriatic (55 trees)
LSU Scott's Yellow (25 trees)

The only tree I got last year that did not make a single fig was LSU Scott's Black.

Right now I plan on planting 1,200 seedlings in ground at 4ft spacing on 1 acre. Small scale fig breeding program...

And 1,200 common figs, 600 in pots and 600 In ground on 2 acres at 8 ft spacing. With hoophouses over them for rain protection.

Other good varieties I'm growing are.

1. Panachee (200)
2. Peter's Honey (85)
3. LSU Gold (35)
4. LSU Golden Celeste (30)
5. LSU Purple (30)
6. MBVS (30)
7. Italian Black Becnel (25)
8. Sal's/EL (15)
8. Sultane (15)
9 Hardy Chicago (10)
10. Flanders (10)

Hey figgysid1, What a setup! The hoop houses are definitely not for snow/cold....zone 12A...definitely for rain, it probably rains most days. Sounds like a winning project. The outcome of the seedlings should be interesting...keep us posted.

figgysid1,
thx 4 the info.
Can cuttings be sent from the mainland to you?

Figgysid1,
It will be interesting to find out how Adriatic JH does as the green/red figs with a berry flavor are my favorite (Battaglia Green and Col de Dame Blanc being 1,2).
I hope you'll keep us informed.
mgg

@mgginva: I can receive cuttings from the mainland. I have 600sq ft space of cuttings rooting, so will be holding off on getting more anytime soon.

I have Strawberry Verte as well, so will be able to compare to JH Adriatic. I will start a thread about everything called (my 2017 season) soon.

Jean  38630 france

figuier del portogallo
madeleine des deux saisons
brown turki
pastliere
ronde de bordeau