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another unknown - please help with ID

Another unknown.  Tasted sweet.  Can someone please help with ID?  Here's a set of photos (chronological order... the ripe and sliced fig pix at the bottom) --

June 9 side view:


June 9 end view:


June 9 side view 2:


June 28 - dominant leaf:


July 15 - dominant leaf:


July 15 - leaf on younger tree:


July 26 - almost ripe:


July 26 - almost ripe 2:


July 27 - still waiting... almost:


July 28 - finally ready to pick:


July 28 - picked (side view)


July 28 - picked (end view showing eye):


July 28 - sliced:


July 28 - sliced (front and back):


Can any of you help me identify it?

Mike   central NY state, zone 5

Cooool!!! Love unknowns! I'm going to guess Red Lebanese 

I have a "Brown Turkey" from a local garden center that is very similar looking. Only one breba this year and the birds pecked it. I was thinking that it is a Celeste, but will have to wait until the main crop is ripe.

Well documented Mike but you left us hanging about the taste. It looks good but is it.Thanks for the photos.
"gene"

Possibly English Brown Turkey

Leaf, fig shape and color resembles english brown turkey. Mine have however had a light pulp color refering to the breba but main crop has redish pulp on mine. Its my second season with this particular plant so dont know if that will change next year.

I have 2 english brown turkey's both look the same in every aspect but the pulp on one of them is always lighter than the other.

Your fig actually looks great not saying 100% its EBT but something along those lines as there seem's to be a few strains of EBT.

Also like to mention the possibility of Paradiso Nero as it is very similar to EBT as well.

I have Emma and  this fig resembles it very closely.

Herman has stated that it is an English Brown Turkey. The Fig, Pulp and Leaf are pretty much dead on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by genecolin
Well documented Mike but you left us hanging about the taste. It looks good but is it.

Gene, yes, it is very good tasting.  It's sweet, kind of like brown sugar sort of sweet.

Thanks for comments from several of you saying it resembles EBT.  Dominick, when you say "Herman has stated...", do you mean that he saw my photos and said that?  Or do you mean that Herman has said that your Emma is an EBT?

Nelson, do you have (maybe already posted?) some photos of Paradiso Nero?

One additional bit of info:  one whole side of it looked very red.  It shows a little in the pic that shows the eye (third from the bottom), but it didn't come across on the computer screen (at least not on my computer screen) looking quite as red-skinned as it looks in person.

Mike   central NY state, zone 5

I saw on a seperate topic that Herman stated Emma resembles EBT.

http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/Emma-Fig-5135193?highlight=emma

My brebas were long and brown with pinkish red flesh. It was okay. I left 2 more and something (Grr) got to them before I did. I have a few main developing but I'm not holding my breath.

Thanks Dominick.  Didn't see any of your pictures of your Emma fig there, but read the description with interest.  If you've got pics, I'd love to see them.

Nelson, please point to pics (or post some) of your Paradiso Nero  (I read a couple of your threads on that one, found with search... saw pics of the tree but I didn't find pics of the fig yet).  

Thanks to all for the suggestion that it might be a kind of EBT.  This fig (this particular one) is smaller than previous years.  Another breba coming along, might be ripe in a week or two.  (Maybe I'll post again once I have pics of that one... it's a little less misshapen).  And interestingly, this is one where the breba seem consistently smaller than the main crop.  (Is that usual for EBT?).

Mike   central NY state, zone 5

Looks very much like my Flanders - which has a breba crop that is enormously long and skinny (search forum for threads with FLANDERS in subject for pics). 

Although, with a fig that long, I was thinking Longe d'Aout could be another possible.  I absolutely don't agree with this being any named variant of Brown Turkey, Eastern, English, or otherwise.

No pics- Critters got the other 2 before taking pics

So Jason I'm glad you agree with me.LOL

Jason,
I took a look at your Flanders pics, and I don't think it's the same.  Though I can see the resemblance that made you think of it, with that long neck.  (Your Flanders neck seems even longer).  Here's why I don't think it's the same though:  
     a) the eye on this unknown was noticeably red, even early on way before ripening.  (Back in the early stages of it... earliest photo I showed was about 8 weeks before ripe, but the eye was red even before that).  And
     b) the pulp color and texture(filament size).  Your Flanders looks amber/brown  (browner when overripe, but more amber brown before that). But this unknown looks distinctly red.  Also the textural look seems a bit different to me also, though that's difficult since both our pics are of figs that are plenty ripe and softening.
Anyway, that's why I think it's not Flanders, despite the other similarities (of which there are plenty).  For anyone's reference, here's the link to Jason's pics of Flanders:   http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/First-to-ripen-breba-2012-Flanders-5849425?highlight=flanders 

I also don't think it's Longue d'Aout.  That one is much larger, and the pulp is different also.  And (although I haven't gotten pics of the main crop on the unknown yet), the main crop of Longue d'Aout is a very different shape from the main crop on this one.  Reports of the flavor also differ (although different tongues make descriptions of flavor at least somewhat unreliable I guess).  Again though, I see similarities.  For reference, there are pics of Longue d'Aout at post 5 in this thread:   http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/Longue-DAout-Fig-with-pics.-5567387?highlight=longue+daout

So I thank you for the effort Jason, and can see what led you to those choices.  But I don't think it's a match yet.  From what I've seen of BT, I have empathy for you disagreeing with this being any kind of BT.  I'm not yet sure.  Do you (or others here) have any further thoughts?

(And if anyone else has pics of Emma, I'm interested to look.  Too bad about critters getting yours Dominick!).

A couple of additional thoughts:  
   1) I've got another breba starting to ripen.  It's a bit more typical of the shape for this tree than that first one was (a little less misshapen), so I'll post photos of that one as soon as it ripens.  (Some of the green photos are of that one already).  And
   2) One of the unusual characteristics of this tree is that the breba tend to be smaller than the main crop.  (The opposite of most figs, not all).

So, do you (Jason or anyone) have other ideas about what it may be?  (and/or pics of the ones suggested above?).

Mike   central NY state, zone 5

That fig tree is English Brown Turkey.
That fruit is a deformed Breba ,because in normal conditions on adult tree the Breba is much larger and not so long.
The deformed Breba is this way because the tree does not have deep roots and was affected by dry climatic conditions.

Here in NJ it get ripe too slow,and needs longer Summer to ripe fruits.
Emma ,too,is English Brown Turkey,so if someone suggested it ,the person was right.
Edit Note:You are in Zone 5,and I thought you are in Tucson AZ.
You will have a serious problem getting main crop ripe,on this fig, in your climate!.

Mike,

Can you post pics of the dominant breba shape? How old is your tree? Any pics of the parent tree and other leaf shapes? How do the main crop fruit look now and when ripe? Is the texture of the leaf rough or smooth?

The dominant breba shape is (when unripe) as in the top two pictures.  The third picture is the unripe breba that then ripened (all the ripe pictures are that specific fig, the one in the third pic of unripe).  This tree is 2 years old, but was made from a clump of sucker trunks that were "shovel propagated" from the mother tree in midsummer of 2010... it was about 18" high then, with roots, and growing as part of a multi-trunk bushy tree that I cut this part off from with a shovel and root ball from a 40-year old tree that gets buried and unburied every year).  The mother tree is a couple hundred miles away, so I can't easily get pictures of it right now (maybe in September).  There are no main crop fruit this year on this younger tree... I'm going from memory of the mother tree's main crop when I described the differences in the main crop figs.  The leaf texture is what I'd call "smooth but not shiny".  That is, it isn't smooth like some of the glossy-leaved trees, rather it has a non-gloss texture.  But it's not rough to the touch like, say, Hardy Chicago.  Does this info help, Ruben?  I'll post pics of the more dominant breba shape as this one ripens  (looks to be about 5-7 days away).

Vasile, thanks for comments.  You're right that the roots might not be in great shape, mostly because the soil this one is in hasn't been optimal (too much clay... didn't want to repot it once it made breba this year, but surely will repot in the late fall or early spring).  It's in a 10 gallon (approx) ceramic pot, with a mix of native (clay-like) soil plus MG potting soil (yuk).  Because it was hard dirt, I cut some holes in the core using a sharpened copper pipe and filled them with perlite and promix (as suggested by al/tapla in some old thread I found).  (I did that to help drainage and to get water into the center of the root ball, rather than having it always follow the edge of the pot).  BUT, I'm in central NY state, zone 5... (don't be misled by "Tucson" in my name... that's just my middle name).  So I don't have a hot climatic condition, and my summer is shorter and cooler than your NJ summer... these figs are ripening though.  I've seen main crop fruit ripen on my dad's tree (also in zone 5, NY state near Buffalo).  Not hot climate here!  

Vasile (or any),  can you explain the ways that English Brown Turkey is different from other Brown Turkey?  I found lots of pics of other BT, but not English.  The other BT pics that I found (including all the BT's plus Texas Everbearing and Osborne Prolific) don't look anything like this fig, at least the breba.

I appreciate all of the help and comments.  Those so far and any more that may come.

Mike   central NY state, zone 5

p.s.  for pics of EBT,  I looked at this thread  http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=4870758&highlight=english+brown+turkey and this thread 
http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/Local-Unknown-ID-Help-5423576?highlight=english+brown+turkey+pics.  Whenever I next get some main crop figs (none this year), I'll compare them with Nelson's and Ruben's great photos in those.  So far the breba don't seem the same to me though.  These breba always have a long neck, and have always been smaller than the mains (on the mother tree).  Some of the leaves look close, but most of Nelson's pics show a much sharper "thumb" pointing back along the petiole toward the branch... that isn't so usual or pronounced on these.

Mike:It will ripe in pot just fine.
For unknown reason English Brown Turkey did not want to get ripe main crop ,when in ground,but in pot it was getting ripe,one by one till the end of season.
Of course about one third will never ripe.
All English Brown Turkey have one shape on main crop,Turbinate and orange brownish exterior with light faded pink interior.
Like this:See Pix,how it should look when at prime shape.
Other Brown Turkey are smaller rounder and more purple,while California BT,is huge and purple.

    Attached Images

  • Click image for larger version - Name: Dscn0318.jpg, Views: 37, Size: 127929

Mike:It will ripe in pot just fine.
For unknown reason English Brown Turkey did not want to get ripe main crop ,when in ground,but in pot it was getting ripe,one by one till the end of season.
Of course about one third will never ripe.
All English Brown Turkey have one shape on main crop,Turbinate and orange brownish exterior with light faded pink interior.
Like this:See Pix,how it should look when at prime shape.
Other Brown Turkey are smaller rounder and more purple,while California BT,is huge and purple.

    Attached Images

  • Click image for larger version - Name: Dscn0318.jpg, Views: 20, Size: 127929

Okay, after extensive searching I finally located a color illustration of the much discussed English Brown Turkey breba. This image comes from the 1880 English publication called Florist and Pomologist by an English fig authority of the time named Dr. Robert Hogg. You can view the entire publication for free here since the file is 31 Mb in size and much too big to post here. Bear in mind that the fruit pictured is of a breba. Apparently, in England, that is the only reliable crop they could grow outdoors without creating ideal conditions or forcing inside a greenhouse.

    Attached Images

  • Click image for larger version - Name: Brown_Turkey_Illustration_from_The_Florist_and_Pomologist-_1880.jpg, Views: 30, Size: 176986

The pigment on that print is way off but the Leaf and fruits have typical shape.
Naturally it looks like my picture,made up look like the print.

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