Just curious ... putting this in its own thread....

There is a possibility that I may move in the next 3-4 years or sooner.  I am worried about losing the dozen or so fruit trees we have around the house.  Specifically, my plums .... they are the "AU Rosa" variety from Auburn University's breeding program.

It is almost time to prune the tree and I am about to have a ton of scion afterwards that I can grow.  I don't want to grow a bunch of trees only to find they will die if not grafted (due to disease or other).  I'd rather graft some now and have something to drop in the ground if/when we move. 

My problem is, I can't seem to find anyone that knows much about the AU Rosa plum except for some random postings about them from a guy named "Joe" at a citrus forum, who is also posting on the GW forum.  I don't know him, so I haven't blindsided him with an email yet, thought I'd ask here first ;)

I know lots of my fig friends here grow TONS of other fruits and are incredibly knowledgable about everything fruit related - and if nothing else, a few of you are really connected with NAFEX and CRFG and may know someone who has the answers to these questions:

* Is AU Rosa plum typically grafted onto a rootstock?

* If yes, do you know what variety of root stock is best?

* Are there any cases where root stock is NOT necessary for AU Rosa?


Please mind that I am in the southeast, and there are a ton of diseases that affect plum trees in this area, which could have a bearing on whether some other root stock is necessary for this plum or not.

As always, thanks to anyone that can help.

Jason,
I don't have an answer for you myself but I can give my local hort friend a call in the morning. He may or may not know something about the AU Rosa plum. I'll check with him and get back to you.

Here's an alternate thought; If you have plenty of scion that you could share with someone who might be happy to graft them on the promise of returning some scion to you at a future time....... Or maybe even having a grafted tree ready for you - depending on whether or not their rootstock would be compatible with your growing area.

I'd be happy to give that a shot but I'd have to do it through my above mentioned friend since I have no prunus rootstock of my own.

Jason,

ROOT STOCK
Peaches, plums and nectarines are highly susceptible to nematodes in the Deep South, especially in sandy soils. Nemagard or Guardian are the preferred rootstocks as they offer resistance to the pesky little worms. Our trees for Zone 8 are grafted on Nemaguard while the tropical plums are grafted onto Guardian.

source: Just Fruits and Exotics (http://justfruitsandexotics.com/Plums.htm) yellow box at the bottom of the page. If you email JFE or ask via facebook, you will get reply. Tell them I sent you :~)

JD

Ok so I broke down. I decided to get a dozen and a half rootstock and give a go at grafting.

I'm looking at Lovell for the rootstock. I'll call Johnson tomorrow to see what they used on my trees. At $2.50 per stock, that's not much to lose. Hell of a lot cheaper than fig scion when you consider the rootstock is already rooted. ;)

What graft is best suited for grafting plums onto rootstock?

Jason.

Looks like you got the rootstock issue worked out.

I've never done any grafting to speak of myself. But I am gearing up to do some this year. I have a few varieties of plum scion to work with as well as some Asian pear.

I plan to graft some of the Asian pear onto an existing pear tree that was knocked down in an ice storm but grew back from the rootstock. I also intend to share some of the pear scion with a friend.

As for the plum, I plan to graft some onto a peach rootstock. Anyone know why this shouldn't work? I'm also thinking about grafting some plum onto our native wild cherry as rootstock. Again, am I going down the wrong path here?

I recently practiced a number of different grafts using some branches taken from my pear tree. I tried the whip & tongue that Bass mentioned as well as the cleft and the saddle graft. 

1.) The whip & tongue method seemed to make the most seemless union as long as the scionwood and rootstock are very close to the same diameter. 

2.) I liked the simplicity of the cleft graft. Just remember that if your scion is smaller in diameter than the rootstock, be sure to move it to one side so the cambium is in good contact on at least one side.

3.) I also liked the saddle graft. It was pretty simple and it seemed to make the most solid union of the three. This was the case on the two pieces of wood I used (practiced with) anyway.

So, my plan is to experiment with all three of these grafting techniques this season. I also plan to try a little bark (or rind) grafting on one of my larger apple trees. That is, as long as my neighbor will share some scionwood with me from one of his trees :-) . 

Jason, where are you getting your rootstock?

Bass, Now you've got me thinking about calling Raintree to ask them about their rootstock. This propagation thing just keeps going & going :) . 

Jason,
Try this site   http://www.extension.umn.edu/distribution/.../dg0532c.html [you might have to type "grafting " into the search bar]
   I understand that most [well producing] plums are grafted on rootstock, and even knowing next to nothing about grafting, I was successful last year at grafting my first plum. I bought a cheap peach on a root-stock, clipped it off and did a "Cleft Graft". This gave me two shots at success and more vertical growth. Both grafts "took" . The one I decided to keep did real well and is ready to bust out new growth.
   The one I grafted is a Hollywood plum, my favorite one of the four on my "crazy-tree".
   I am not familiar with the AU ROSA, but the rootstock you choose depends partly on where the tree is going to end up - soil type etc. . Look into Nemaguard root-stock. .. good luck

@Bass, for the southeast, Lovell and Nemagard are recommended, apparently Myrobalan is an option as well. All are fairly disease resistant and don't mind wet soil.

@Bill, plum peach and cherry are all stone fruit. I don't see why you would have problems. I can't answer your question about grafting to wild cherries... This is something that one other member and I were discussing by private message - using chokecherry as a rootstock. Dunno if it would work. Rootstock is so cheap, I love free, but.... Anyway, Raintree is where I found my rootstock, they are the only reputable nursery I found that sells in small quantities to people like you and I (non-commercial) : http://www.raintreenursery.com/catalog/productdetails.cfm?productid=R405 - although Dave Wilson would sell if you buy in quantities of 150+, I don't have that much wood....

Hey Jason

I saw a guy selling lovell seedling on the macon Ga. Craigslist, I think he was in perry Ga. .... I was trying to find fig trees or cuttings to get when I ran across the ad.. I can't remember what all he had, but I know he was selling lovell,some kind of plum,LSU type fig (I think purple) and other seedlings/rootings for $5 each..and he did ship... I didn't get any because I'm down in costal Ga. and its sandy loamy soil,, more sand = more nematodes.. you are above the fall line in Ga. so your soil is diffrent up there.. I'm am going to try and find floragaurd or some other seed for stock that is resistant to nematodes and the peach tree death deal where they die after 10 or so years.. I'm no expert but I belive any rootstock that works on peaches will work on most stone fruit and almonds..

a Video on AU Rosa plum

If you still need rootstock, try Johnson Nursery in Ellijay, Ga, they grow their own.

@goldie, thanks, that's where I got the two AU Rosa trees I have now.  I've always enjoyed working with them, although they totally started ignoring my emails after complaining that two bareroot Montmonrency cherries and one 7gal Montmorency chery all died.

@Bass, thanks for the link, but ... TyTy nursery is a scam!  Same store selling the spraypainted blue figs ;) 

Jason, they put so much effort into their videos...
I might ask you for a couple scions, it sounds like a good plum.

It is supposed to be magnificent.  It is an insanely vigorous grower, in year 1 it was planted bareroot as a 2' whip with 1/2" diameter.  It grew 1' and and up to 1" trunk diameter with half a dozen tiny branches the first year.  In year two, it went from approximately 36" tall to almost 12' and 14' tall respectively, and the trunk is approximately 4" diameter, and there are several branches larger than 1" thick, I will have a considerable amount to prune.  We are entering year 3, so we may see fruit this year.  Basically, first year was very slow.  Second year, the tree added almost 10' of height and the trunk quadrupled in thickness.

Send me your address by private message.  I am happy to send a few large sticks your way after I prune (waiting for rootstock to arrive before pruning).

Can anyone please tell me quickly how far up the rootstock I should graft?  I have a good 18" to work with, but I notice most grafted fruit trees I've ever purchased are grafted literally less than 3"-5" above the soil line.

Unfortunately, my plum tree is already budding and my rootstock just arrived Thursday evening.  I'm going to give a shot at grafting a dozen, even though my plum tree is breaking dormancy.

@Bass, if I have some luck by summer with several of these, I'll be sure to send one your way, my friend.  Mother Nature decided to wake everything up early on us this year with what I fear is a "false" spring.

When grafting you want to keep the affect of the rootstock,  by grafting at least 6" or more above soil line. You don't want the scion to eventually root into the soil and loses the dwarfing affects of the rootstock. You should have taken scions early in winter and keep in fridge. but you still can do budding in summer if they fail for you now.

It was quite confusing (pruning), plums are new for me.  The nursery I bought this from specifically instructed me to wait until mid-to-late February to prune in the documents they provided.  Hindsight is 20/20?

After trying to saddle graft one cutting for 20 minutes, I quickly realized that whip & tongue was the way to go.  I managed to graft all 12 in slightly more time than it took to tinker with one saddle graft.  I am taking the pessimist view on this, and expect that maybe only 1-2 trees will make it, but we will see.

I grafted about 4" above the root crown and planted them with the graft about 2"-3" above soil.

I'm still curious - should I wax or seal the top of the scion?
Should I wax or seal around the tape?
Is there any product I can find locally to seal with?

This was the end result as they were going into the pots.

Hey Bass. Shouldn't Jason be cutting off most of the scion above the rootstock - leaving only about 3-4 buds above the rootstock? 

If you still have some rootstock left, you can also pot them & grow them out for next year. You could then try some bud or even cleft grafting on the then larger rootstock. 

I saw a mixed bag at YouTube regarding how short to cut.

One person made sense:  They said you want to cut 2-4 buds above the graft to save scion.  I had an abundance of scion, so I left about 12" above the graft and several buds.

So, here another question:  What is the gain of cutting 3-4 buds above the union?  Is there any downside to leaving this much wood above the union?

Jason,

I took a grafting class (whip & tongue and bark grafting) on last Sunday at Just Fruits & Exotics. So my comments are based on what I learned and what we did (hands on) with persimmon rootstock and scion wood; and some plum scion wood that I grafted today. Nothing else...Like you, I just figured I would give it a shot.

Concerning a local product. I only have experience with grafting wax but I have read others sing the praises of plumber's putty, acrylic latex caulk (HD/Lowes/Ace), parafilm (haven't found a source in TLH), and plain old masking tape.

Although you did not ask, I thought I would share what JFE recommends/advises

1) 4"-6" above the root stock crown,
2) more surface area on the whip, i.e., a longer cut provides a greater chance for success,
3) wrap 1/2"-1" above and below the graft, and after the graft is wrapped,
4) cut the scion wood down to 2-3 buds only. Then ...

Yes. Wax the top of the scion wood and a portion (or all of the tape). Dry out protection. We dipped our whip & tongue grafts into grafting wax and it covers the scion wood and some of the tape.

Again, I am no expert!

I learned something yesterday from a plumber-turned nursery owner yesterday.

Teflon tape works nearly as well as parafilm for moisture-proofing and bud breakthrough.

Plumber's putty is indeed a great way to seal the end cut of your scion.

I teflon-taped my joints tonight and will plumbers-putty the freshly-trimmed tips tomorrow morn.

Keeping my fingers crossed - I am seeing some growth progression on the scion, so I think my cambium pairing is solid on a couple.

Ps 520ft of 1/2" teflon tape = $1 at Home Depot.

Jason have you or anyone else ever tried green gage or yellow egg plum?Thanks

Never had either, myself.  I've never seen those two available in my area.

Hey There,   My four-on-one tree has a Green Gage. Great flavor. Kicks ass fresh from the tree as well as mixed in with a salad. Its not at all what I expected at first. If you have a chance to grow one, do it. ...you never know what you are missing.