Ciao, Just today I correspond with Sergio, in Liguria to dig more information of his tree he introduced to a few of us in the U.S. (Valle Negra) I found the information very interesting. For the most part he aquired this fig from a mountains above the town of Breno, which is in the Valle Camonica, The Romans named this valley for the original Italic tribe (inhabitants) of this valley, the valley is nicknamed by locals of Valle Negra because in the winter the mountains shadow the valley and it is dark, so why valle negra name, this is all within the province of Brescia, Lombardia (Lombardy). This area is very very mountainous, Ihave not traveled much up there, only once in Milano, which is in same region, but the actual landscape is very different, it is very aired soil and dry, very very dry, it is actually the Alps mountains...... This fig grows spontaneous in this area and it is an area which is very very very cold in wintertime, of course up there the usual Italian heat is not previlent. In winters it is not uncommon for this area to receive much snowfall and much rain and very cold temperatures. This tree is hardy there. I will make a summer cuttings and just stick into the ground and will check to see how hardy this tree is here in the montains of central Pa,, I will see. The area of Lombardia can get very cold, but I don't know if it is still warmer than here, which is good chance it is still warmer, but for where this fig is native, it probably stands a good chance of being very cold hard. Plus it is a very tasty black fig as well. Okay enough talk from me,, could be cold hardy candidate.. ciaociao

Maggie , thanks for all the information and update. Sounds like it could be a cold hardy indeed !

Thanks for the additional info Maggie.

Have a few questions.

# 1. Any idea of how far up the mountain from Breno, does Valle Negra grow.

# 2. Is there more then one Valle Negra, or are there different strains?

# 3. Any idea of how far from Breno, is Robbia, Switzerland?

# 4. In checking my source for historical weather, the closest I could get for a weather station, for Breno, was Robbia, Switzerland.  They have a recorded a low of 3 degrees February 1, 2010.But, I could not find any weather data for the area beyond 2007.

Has any one been able to get the lowest  winter weather readings for Breno it's self?

Thanks again for the research on this.

Bob Connecticut - zone 5b/6a

Bob, Zurich is 128 miles.Years ago, I took a vacation to Rome, Southern Italy and Zurich and others. Rode a cable car
from just North of Zurich up into the Swiss/Italian Alps. Beautiful.

Valle Negra seems like it would have a fighting chance for our winters with minimal protection. I think if it was in a good location and had the wind blocked it might do good. Now the next thing to do is to get my relatives who are about 140 miles east of Breno in the town of Ivrea to send me cuttings. I haven't seen them in years so slim chance of that:(

Hey Maggie, is this Valle Negra?

ciao Bob, I was told it comes from 395 meters,,, which is a higher than Breno itself, but not much.. Mind that the area is Not the High Alps, but the foothills. I don't know what other strains there may be. I only have the one from Sergio which there may be others, Ihave no idea, mine is long fingered, shrubby growth and delicious black fruit.... Breno has an oceanic clima, which is common in much of upper Europe,,, I will research more and will ask question and let you know! Like Tony says, may have fighting chance, I will do more digging ! ciaociao 

Dennis, beautiful, yes it looks like Valle Negra, mine is very very look alike, do you have fruit tried? They are black figs, have you tried them, what did you thinK??

Maggie, I have not tried the figs yet. I bought 2 of these trees from Campbell's Greenhouse in one of the old sections of Charlotte. They were listed as Brown Turkey. I talked with the co- owner of the greenhouse. He confessed that the brown turkey figs came from a local elderly man living in uptown Charlotte years ago. He would not give me the man's name and I respect that. He did say the man was not originally from Charlotte, but talks with an accent. He said, the figs are not brown, but black. The owner said, he has no knowledge of figs, but does get trees from local growers but most of his figs come from Monrovia. He said, the 2 trees I bought tree did not have a Monrovia tag, just a plain brown turkey tag that's because a local person gave him cuttings years ago and they propagate them. That was 6 years ago. He said, in our area people ask for Brown Turkey by name so if they run out of the Monrovia Brown Turkeys, they push the local Brown Turkey figs. After I bought my trees, I told him they were not Brown Turkeys. He said he knows because the figs do not look like the Monrovia Brown Turkeys. I said, that's because they are not. He said, the Monrovia Brown Turkey leaves are fatter. He said, the local Brown Turkey leaves are longer. He said, they have to push the Monrovia because they have more money tied up in them. Plus he said people like to see fancy pretty labels. I asked if that was why all the Monrovia products were in walk way and the local brown turkeys were stuck in the back. He said yes. I found one more of these trees stuck way back in the a corner of the greenhouse. The price was the same.

Maggie, the leaves on my tree are identical to your tree. I do think they're Valle Negra. I'll post a lot of pictures of the figs when they ripen this summer.

We will definitely know Dennis when we compare photographs especially of fruits, I would be leary especially if there is not direct tie to Sergio! Whether or not is very identical so far,, now like I said to compare fruits!!! I think is crock of ~stuff~ what some people do to sell figs trees,,, If he knew it was not brown turkey he should put "I don't know on tag" instead of name he knows not to be true, it just to add to confusion, mannaggia!

Maggie,

     This is way off topic, but you have used a word I would hear as a child come from my grandfather's mouth and I have never heard a good explanation of it's meaning, just from context, so now I have to ask you to explain "mannaggia." (In his San Pietrese dialect the end of the word was clipped off.) 

LOL Dale,,, I think this was my babies first word , I use all the time, we always cuss as kids, we were aloud as long as we didn't take God's name in vein!!! In the Italian pronounce yes it would sound like end chop off a bit.. I can only describe this word at best as a very miserable discusted DAMN IT! ciaociao!

Well, that's why I never got an explanation until now! Awaiting my opportunity to acquire Valle Negra. Grazzi!

i do have Valle Negra,it is not B.T.IT may be releted to Negronne,have both Valle Negra
was send to me by Sergio,will try to compare them this year,anyway both are very good figs
for my area upstate ny.Ciao,
Giuseppe

ciao maggie, what's you opinion on the difference between Valle Negra and Valle Calda. following GW forum, they are different figs but some have doubts. it seems leaves are very similar.

Hi Maggie, so much to comment on in this thread!  Good to see you posting on here again.  As you know, I have some Valle Negra on order, and the main reason is because I want to try them out in my cold climate of zone 5a (well, that's one reason anyway... aside from the fact that it is said to be a very tasty fig!).  And what a great laugh to see the word Mannaggia again!  I can still hear my dad and my grandmother saying it in my memories, when I see you write it here.  (And yes, that is exactly the word for these crazy people who put the name Brown Turkey on everything they sell, even when they know it is wrong).  I'm still looking forward to growing Valle Negra here... to me it almost looks related to Aubique Petit, but I know it is different too.  Will be interesting to see how it does in this climate compared with other cold hardy figs.

Giuseppe, where in upstate NY do you grow this one?  Do you have it in ground or potted?  I'm in the hills to the northwest of Binghamton, trying out a variety of cold hardy figs, hoping to find ones that do well with minimal winter protection.  How do you protect your Valle Negra in winter here?

Mike   central NY state, zone 5a

Mike, where are you ordering Valle Negra from.  I'd love to test it's hardiness as well.

Mike,
I leave in Spencerport NY seven miles oway from Rochester ny.Over the years I have
tryed many fig trees in the ground with minimum protection,to name a few Marsille ,
B.T. and Celeste from Miller Nursery,Negretta ecc.none has survived in my area.I have
a nice Florea that i will try next in two more years,hope it will survive here.So my figs
are all potted I use 55 plastic gallons that I cut in half and to make things easy for me
they all are on wheels and store them in my detached unheated garage for the winter.Ciao,
Giuseppe

I think that Giuseppe's experience with cold hardy figs, confirms what i have noticed here in Connecticut.

We have been growing & testing cold hardy figs here now, for around 8 years.

I'm starting to notice that deep cold is not the only problem in getting figs through our cold northern winters. Figs must also be protected against winter wind, and winter and spring sun.

Giuseppe's closest weather station is Rochester. Rochester showed a winter low of minus 12 degrees Fahrenheit, in 2004. To me Spencerport is possibly a 5b/6a, zone. Giuseppe is keeping his figs in a detached, unheated garage. So, I can't see the inside of his garage being warmer then the outside, minus the winter wind.

The first time I saw of Giuseppe reporting on Valle Negra, he indicted that it was able to keep it's breba, while enduring his winters, in his detached, unheated garage. My experience has been if a fig can keep it's breba at minus 10 degrees and lower, there is a pretty good chance that it can produce a main crop of figs in a zone 6a most of the time. That is if it is protected from winter wind, and winter and spring sun. Plus, the other winter survival techniques that must be used in growing figs in cold climates. 

On top of being cold hardy, some collectors are indicating that our Northeast rainy fall weather does not water down it's flavor. That's a big plus.

Of the two dozen or so cold hardy figs that we are currently growing, testing and or selling, I would put Valle Negra in the top half dozen figs, that show a lot of potential for us northern growers.

Are there any growers who have been growing Valle Negra and Nero 600M side by side?

I'm hearing from some growers that they are the same. But, have heard other growers say they are not. Is it possible there are different strains of Valle Negra?

Can any one else add their experience gowning these two, side by side? 

Bob Connecticut Zone 5b/6a 

This is one awesome thread! Man you guys rock! I've booked this thread and will be posting pictures of the figs from my 2 trees this summer. And yes I have figs on both trees now. Come on Summer!

I will get back to all these questions as soon as I can I am cooking now!! I know Sergio named and sent the Valle Calda, (HOT) valley figs to America but I am not familiar I don't have one. I would like to experiment......  I will be back soon to answer in more detail,, Imissed my thread answering another and have much food now! ciao!

I have three of these growing in pots from cuttings obtained earlier this year.  One of my most vigorous figs thus far.

This is one on my "Figs from Maggie " wish list !! I was late this year , but there's next year .  ; ))

Happy to hear anything about them.

LOL Martin,, you know how we do, Sunday is the big day, well everyday is a big day with food HA! I made melanzana, fried hot peppers, sausage, meatballs very good! ciao Robert! you are correct even if can take the cold it is the winds and dry that will kill them,, I am sticking  one Valle Negra plant into the ground straight but am putting it in sunny but sheltered with a hill like it was in Italy and see how it does for this winter I will not protect,, I can afford to loose a stick! I will see! I hope.. Only problem is I do not in my minds eye think that Breno is as cold in winter months as Pennsylvania,, I just have a feeling, but it doesn't matter it is still much colder than many fig varieties can handle without dying, and if it can stand here,, 6b in our town 7 at our house as we are close to downtown, it should work for many people