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garden_whisperer

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Posted Reply with quote  #51 
What system you got.
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Dave Zone 6b Illinois

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eboone

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Posted Reply with quote  #52 
Before joining this forum I had never heard of 'cloning'.  I think I grasp what is being recommended here, but can anyone point to a good article or reference on the subject?

Thanks!
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Ed
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Posted Reply with quote  #53 
Cloning really just means taking a part of a plant and producing a plant from it... in this case we are using a mist or bubble method. There is a lot of good info, some of the more detailed on the cannabis sites... 
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jdsfrance

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Posted Reply with quote  #54 
Hi eebone,
Well cloning is not really the right word here but is used for shorting the phrase: "a way of reproduction/multiplication that raises siblings that are supposed to be identical to the parent".
So here, people are referring to taking cuttings and rooting them .
Well this is the theory and there is the real life that shows that even by cloning sometimes you don't get the exact copy of the original living "thing" because at some point some genes will get altered in one or more siblings
and that sibling will not be the copy of its parent .
But theory is, you clone a living thing and get exact copies of that living with that process - be it a vegetable or an animal.
This is to oppose to sexual reproduction where siblings get genes from two parent living "things" and so are not copies either of the father nor of the mother .

Cloning as a theory is a great deception as a former school boy as when you look at cloned cats, their coats are not identical - Cloned cats and cows get stains at different places on their coats with is weird and
for me not true to the original cloning theory as I had understood it.
Cloning is already used in farms to copy champion animals . Think of cattle, horses, cats, dogs with special and sharp abilities like strong smelling capacity for custom dogs.

Out of topic but, by the way, I saw a reportage last month that on your side of the pond, you are already buying meat from such cloned cattle ... Bon appétit !
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Posted Reply with quote  #55 
Quote:
Originally Posted by eboone
Before joining this forum I had never heard of 'cloning'.  I think I grasp what is being recommended here, but can anyone point to a good article or reference on the subject?

Thanks!


Ed, start with this video.  This guy has a few other videos that are pretty good, too.  Aeroponic Cloner is pretty easy to set up.
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Posted Reply with quote  #56 
Dave, the bucket does not work for figs.  I think the water mass is enough to keep the pump from over heating BUT too hot for the fig cuttings.  Ten gallon plus should be fine.
 
I am so glad others have started playing around with this system.  The trick is not to have the cutting in the water.  The bubbler/mister that Pete and Gloria made works!  My homemade kit worked too.  The fresher the cutting the better!  I was able to get some moldy Nero 600m cuttings to root.  I only had 6 and all 6 rooted!
 
I echo what Gloria said.  Youtube can be you best friend on how to do some of this stuff.  I researched for days before testing on some moldy fig cuttings.  The youtube link that Danny provided is one of the best I've seen.  It's the one I used to build mine.  Just make sure you build it with a lot of misters and not a heavy duty pump.  My pump is to strong.....even though I can adjust the flow rate.   But it still leaks a little. Here's a tip!  Check out Harbor Freight!  They got cheap pumps next to nothing.  They're at the back of the store located next to garden hose kits and such.
 
But!  Don't forget, to go ahead and build (or buy) your T5 light kit and hang them above the cloner.  Why?  Because the cuttings will root and need light to feed their leaves.  I got lucky and got one of those power strips with a build in timer.  Half of the switches can be on 24/7 and the other half turns my lights on at 6AM and off at 6PM.  That's pretty cool stuff!!!!!

HOW BOUT THOSE FIGS!!!!!
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Dennis
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twobrothersgarden

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Posted Reply with quote  #57 
They even have a cloning machine that expresses the hot air that gets built up in the machine. It uses a fan to express the air.


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Posted Reply with quote  #58 
This thread has me searching for cloners. I don't plan on rooting much or many at a time. Can anyone recommend a good smaller cheaper system or diy system?
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GRamaley

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Posted Reply with quote  #59 
I started with the Oxyclone   https://www.google.com/shopping/product/6769896641981974842?espv=2&biw=1304&bih=824&q=oxyclone&spell=1&psj=1&bav=on.2,or.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.80120444,d.eXY&tch=1&ech=1&psi=a1JtVI1dhaWDBNXgg-gE.1416450630939.5&sa=X&ei=cVJtVKqJDcirNsCpgFg&ved=0CGgQuSQ

I just used cheap airstones instead of the pump that came with it..
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Posted Reply with quote  #60 
nice set up Dennis, will give it a try myself....luke
Gofigure

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Posted Reply with quote  #61 
Follow up to my experience on page 1:
I never developed roots more than 1/8" long after a month of well water only and a cap of hydrogen peroxide every few days but the ph was affecting the leaf color (going yellow). I never changed the water which still did not smell or have any slime. I also never had to top it off since the container was sealed so well and the leaves were not very big.

I decided at that point to take them out, remove the leaves and put them in sphagnum. I had roots in a day. Took them out, put in seedling starter mix in peat pots. I should have up potted the one pictured sooner. All are growing and none died.

I'll try spring water instead next time (less hard than my well water) and only use the bubbler for a week before placing into moss. It would probably work well for cuttings coming out of cold storage for rehydration.

IMG_1482.jpg 
IMG_1480.jpg 

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Posted Reply with quote  #62 
Update 11/14/15

On October 9th, I placed 2 types of cuttings inside my cloner. Six Grisse de' Olivette and 6 Napolanta Negra. Today, I potted up 6 of them. The roots were crazy long! Here are a few pictures of 3 potted and 3 getting ready to be potted. I should have potted these up 2 weeks ago but I wasn't ready.


Attached Images
jpeg image.jpeg (668.67 KB, 126 views)
jpeg image.jpeg (823.63 KB, 122 views)
jpeg image.jpeg (825.11 KB, 99 views)


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Dennis
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Smungung

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Posted Reply with quote  #63 
Gofigure how did you make the coffee can cloner do u have a post about it?
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Posted Reply with quote  #64 
Looks great Dennis, now im anxious to get my cloner up and running now i see these 5 week results. Kudos!
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SuperMario1

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Posted Reply with quote  #65 
I'm in the clone zone too.  One problem I have noticed is that the PH needs to be regularly adjusted and the water temp is staying higher than I'd like. Anyone else notice their PH levels moving toward basic constantly?  Still though, the plants are growing well, lots of root initials, and a couple decent little roots popping up.  Like Snaglpus said, the fresher the cutting the better.  I stuck a couple green ones in there and had nice little root initials in 3 days.  Also they seem to like the Hydrogen Peroxide additive.

clones.jpg

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snaglpus

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Posted Reply with quote  #66 
Yes, Hydrogen Peroxide additive helps a lot! Nice job!
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Dennis
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Posted Reply with quote  #67 
What'd does the peroxide do?
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Matthew Mei Age:15 Zone 6A Secaucus, New Jersey

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Posted Reply with quote  #68 
Quote:
Originally Posted by snaglpus
Yes, Hydrogen Peroxide additive helps a lot! Nice job!

Thanks Dennis, I couldn't have done it without your posts and some help from rafaelissimo.
Matt, among other things, the H202 has an extra oxygen atom which helps the plants get some. This is particularly important when water temps are above ideal, but is always good.  A lot of good information on cloning, areoponics, and hydroponics can be found on cannabis forums as well.   
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Currently Growing: a bunch of varieties.




snaglpus

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Posted Reply with quote  #69 
bump
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Dennis
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Posted Reply with quote  #70 
How much Hydrogen Peroxide do you recommend? I started with a 5 gallon bucket.

I built my cloner in October. I have leaves and root initials but no roots yet.
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Marion
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snaglpus

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Posted Reply with quote  #71 
Add a tablespoon every 3 days. But good luck using that 5 gallon bucket! The cuttings I tested in the 5g bucket ALL died. The water was too hot and unable to regulate. Good luck.
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Posted Reply with quote  #72 
Hi Dennis,
Thank you.

My 5 gallon bucket has no heat at all. I started it with some confederate rose (Hibiscus Mutabilis) cuttings. They all have leaves and root initials, but no roots yet.

I need to start another cloner for fig cuttings.
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Marion
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Posted Reply with quote  #73 
Quote:
Originally Posted by K6MZMarion
Hi Dennis,
Thank you.

My 5 gallon bucket has no heat at all. I started it with some confederate rose (Hibiscus Mutabilis) cuttings. They all have leaves and root initials, but no roots yet.

I need to start another cloner for fig cuttings.


If you have a submersible pump, then that generates heat.  If you have an external one, it may still warm the water a bit.  I check my water temps.  Too hot, then little oxygen and slime mold appears and your cuttings will become less likely to root/more likely to rot, too cool and no roots/stagnant root development.  For me 84 degrees was the max before slime sets in, Ideally I want to keep it between 74-80. 

Just remember that if you have a cutting that is not responding to the cloner and the end is rotting, you can cut off the rotten portion (do a "hot water rescue" if need be) and try another method for rooting.  Don't give up on cuttings until they are truly dead. Also be cautious about placing the cloner under a lamp for 2 reasons: 1) the light will increase water/room temperature and; 2) the light will stimulate vegetative growth which can dehydrate your cuttings and stymie root development.  You may place the cloner under a lamp and have great success depending on the type and freshness of the cutting, the quality of the areoponic solution (ph levels and hormone or nutrient selection), and the temperature/humidity of the environment.
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Currently Growing: a bunch of varieties.




K6MZMarion

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Posted Reply with quote  #74 
The water in my 5 gallon clone bucket is 19C (66.2F). I have a submersible pump in the bucket.
Is that too cool for roots to grow? Should I  add a heater? My cuttings are happy. They are growing leaves. The roots are just taking their sweet time. I am not in a hurry.
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Posted Reply with quote  #75 
I think that is a little too cool for good rooting, but maybe your results will prove different. Lets hope so.  The problem with growing leaves without rooting is that the vegetative growth uses up moisture, energy, and nutrients that could be used to grow roots.  When you see green growth and no roots then the countdown begins.  It is a race to see whether your cutting will root before the vegetative growth sucks the life out of your cuttings.  Sometimes you win, sometimes you loose.
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Wish list:  Galicia Negra, Violetta, Violette de Sollies, Dan_la's Black Beauty 10, Craven's Craving, Most important: YOUR FAVORITE FIG. A lot of people put emphasis on popular/exotic cultivars, which is great because it highlights some of the better fig varieties; however, I am most interested in the figs our members love regardless of pedigree. 
Currently Growing: a bunch of varieties.




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Posted Reply with quote  #76 
Mario, is spot on with what he said!  My EZ Cloner 64 holds around 5 gallons of water.  It sits in my garage on the floor.  It's very cool in there so I'm not too concerned about water temp.  However, I do have my cloner under T5 lights.  Its very bright in there and a tad bit warm under those lights.  But I also add hydrogen peroxide every 3 days.  My water is not that hot.  Having the unit on the concrete floor helps to keep the water down.  I don't have slime but I do have warm brown water.  Roots are forming but last year, I left my cutting in for 30 plus days.  Looks like I will do the same this year.  The air temp inside my garage is around 55 to 59 degrees.  My garage is insulated including the double garage doors.  This winter it has been the warmest yet.  I am hoping it will continue. 

My cutting have no mold but if I had mold, it would not live because I have constant air flow across the room.  And every day, I swap air by opening the garage door for a while.  If it gets warm outside, and it will be 70 degrees tomorrow and Saturday....my garage temp will increase to around 65 degrees.  I have a wireless temp sensor that sends data back to my base station inside my house right next to my easy chair. 

  I want to try Charlie's sand method but I currently have an abundance of cuttings and I can place a 100 or so in my cloners in a very small spot.

How bout those figs!!!!!!
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Posted Reply with quote  #77 
SuperMario1: i just saw green on a cupple of my cuttings & no roots so i moved one over into the ProMix that was recommended. Im hoping that will help root them so keeping my fingers crossed.
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Posted Reply with quote  #78 
Snaglpus: Thanks buddy, just trying to relay the information I learned from pros like you.

Smyfigs: I'll cross my fingers for you too.  I had quite a few in the cloner that had leaves and later rooted before any problems came up.  Sometimes is about trying to find the best method for that particular cutting. I had some that refused to do anything in the cloner, and later tried a different method with the same cutting and BOOM roots galore.  Figs are tough plants, and you will be amazed at how some supposed "goners" spring back. I have a St. Rita that I call my "zombie" for that very reason.  It was a miserable small dead-looking dried-out cutting that refused to root. . Then I switched some things around and now it is rooting well. However, it is still not out of the woods yet. The point is, sometimes persistence and creativity pay off.

FYI I have just came up with a sort-of different method that works well to root figs.  I should post pics, but I'm lazy... maybe later.  Basically I hydrate a brick of cocogro in PH balanced water mixed with RapidStart (the same mix I use in my cloner). I am careful not to overhydrate the coco, and am patient to let the brick expand. Then I fluff it out, and add more of the water/RapidStart if needed.  Again DO NOT over-hydrate.  I then pour some pearlte in a bowl and per-moisten it with the water/RapidStart solution so that the pours of the rock are filled.  Then I mix the cocogro and pearlite at an estimated 70% coco and 30% pearlite level. After this I place the mix in a container.  I then dip the freshly cut end of the cutting in Clonex Rooting Gel and place it in the mix.  I have some that have a humidity dome over them, and some that do not.  Thus far I have not seen a difference in the rooting success rate. However, the cuttings with the humidity dome seem to be more problematic once leaves start to form.  The tender newly-rooted trees are easily stressed when the humidity dome is removed and the humidity level goes from 100% to about 65%. So far, this method has be really successful.  I got the idea by trying to find an alternative for Root Riot Cubes (since the cubes absorb lots of water and make up-potting more difficult than it should be). The pearlite coco mix is better for up-potting and has been a great medium for rooting.
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Wish list:  Galicia Negra, Violetta, Violette de Sollies, Dan_la's Black Beauty 10, Craven's Craving, Most important: YOUR FAVORITE FIG. A lot of people put emphasis on popular/exotic cultivars, which is great because it highlights some of the better fig varieties; however, I am most interested in the figs our members love regardless of pedigree. 
Currently Growing: a bunch of varieties.




Hobo62288

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Posted Reply with quote  #79 
This seems to be the thread for help on cloners so hopefully someone will chime in. Most people seems to have the problem of the pump heating the water too much but mine is the opposite. My water temp won't stay high enough. I've got it under CFLs with towels wrapped around the bottom to try and help but every 18-24 hours I have to change my watet to keep the temp above 65. I'll start it at 85 and it drops within 24 hours at least. Any ideas? I don't have a heat mat but would it help? The base of my cloner (Clone King 36) has feet that elevate it so those are all that would touch the heat mat if I did that. I'll take any advice or help. Thanks
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Bluemalibu

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Posted Reply with quote  #80 

  Bryan.

   I had the same problem.  I am only cycling my pump ON for 90 seconds, then it is off for 7 1/2 minutes.   So, to keep my water at a constant 72*F, I am using an Eheim-Jager aquarium heater that is submersible.
 
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eheim-Ebo-Jager-Shatter-Proof-Glass-Aquarium-Heater-75-Watt-Reef-FREE-USA-SHIP-/111848753653?_trksid=p2141725.m3641.l6368

 It is inexpensive, and regulates the temp perfect.

Blue
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Posted Reply with quote  #81 
Bryan , what is the room tempo of your cloner/. And where is it located? What type of pump do you have?
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Posted Reply with quote  #82 
Hey Dennis, Ya'll have convinced me, I ordered me a "Clone King 36" should be delivered anytime! : )
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Posted Reply with quote  #83 
Dennis...This is all your fault. I just bought the TurboKlone T24 and built a second home made unit. Very exciting possibilities here.
I think a cloner company should consider using you as their spokesman.
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Posted Reply with quote  #84 
Quote:
Originally Posted by snaglpus
Bryan , what is the room tempo of your cloner/. And where is it located? What type of pump do you have?


Room temp is probably 64-68 because I'm one of those people who like it cool, can't sleep otherwise lol. 64 at night and around 68 during the day just because all the lights being on. The pump it came with is "Aquatop" NP-305 317GPH. I keep the cloner on top of a wooden shelving unit. There is a window directly beside the cloner and a large 2800 lumen cfl in a reflector directly over the cuttings.
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Posted Reply with quote  #85 
Here is the Cloner i built, the only thing i need to figure out is where to put the cable for the pump. I see the notch the guy did in the video, but i'm assuming that would cause more leakage. I had most of the materials on hand and only needed the sprayheads, potcup/neoprene inserts and the pump. 

Just word of advice, you don't necessarily need a tap if you got some strength and dont mind hurting your hands a bit. I drilled 11/64 holes into pvc and then push and twisted the heads in and it threaded the pvc itself. I lost a few heads due to the hole not being perfect or not pressing firm enough though.

I plan on starting in the cloner mid january (due to work travel). Thanks Dennis and everyone for feedback on their experience.

20151223_130406.jpg 
This is going to be my grow setup till the plants get big enough for what you see in the apollo box, then they will move to grow tent. Dont mind all the presents for my daughter ;)

20151223_130332.jpg 





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Matt - Long Island - Zone 7B
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Please use the following thread if your growing my "unknown Sheepshead" to track your progress.
http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/saved-brooklyn-tree-unknown-sheepshead-community-growlog-7808733?pid=1290171384
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Posted Reply with quote  #86 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklynmatty
Here is the Cloner i built, the only thing i need to figure out is where to put the cable for the pump. I see the notch the guy did in the video, but i'm assuming that would cause more leakage. I had most of the materials on hand and only needed the sprayheads, potcup/neoprene inserts and the pump. 

Just word of advice, you don't necessarily need a tap if you got some strength and dont mind hurting your hands a bit. I drilled 11/64 holes into pvc and then push and twisted the heads in and it threaded the pvc itself. I lost a few heads due to the hole not being perfect or not pressing firm enough though.

I plan on starting in the cloner mid january (due to work travel). Thanks Dennis and everyone for feedback on their experience.

20151223_130406.jpg 
This is going to be my grow setup till the plants get big enough for what you see in the apollo box, then they will move to grow tent. Dont mind all the presents for my daughter ;)

20151223_130332.jpg 




Great Job!! Looks as good if not better than the one I bought (Clone King 36) Good Luck!!
btw What is your First Name?? : )
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Posted Reply with quote  #87 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankallen

Great Job!! Looks as good if not better than the one I bought (Clone King 36) Good Luck!!
btw What is your First Name?? : )


Thanks Frank - hopefully once i leak test it , it will perform well. I love the clone king 36, if i didn't get the parts in time i was going to order that myself. Can't wait to see your progress with it.

First name is Matt, Matty was my nickname as a kid. Always liked that nickname :)
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Matt - Long Island - Zone 7B
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Please use the following thread if your growing my "unknown Sheepshead" to track your progress.
http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/saved-brooklyn-tree-unknown-sheepshead-community-growlog-7808733?pid=1290171384
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Posted Reply with quote  #88 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklynmatty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankallen

Great Job!! Looks as good if not better than the one I bought (Clone King 36) Good Luck!!
btw What is your First Name?? : )


Thanks Frank - hopefully once i leak test it , it will perform well. I love the clone king 36, if i didn't get the parts in time i was going to order that myself. Can't wait to see your progress with it.

First name is Matt, Matty was my nickname as a kid. Always liked that nickname :)


Thanks a lot Matt! Like I said you done a great Job on your Cloner!
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Frank from Bama-  Zone 7-b Alabama

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Posted Reply with quote  #89 

  Great job Matt!

   I too went with a larger footprint of piping and 22 EZclone heads.  With that layout, you will have a really nice spray coverage...  what gpm is your pump?  That many heads move a lot of water.  I replaced my 350 gpm with a 600.   The spray is so full that I just run the pump for 90 seconds with 7 1/2 minutes pause.  So far, the cuttings seem to be responding really well with large root growth in just a week.

  As to the cord...  I just ran it out one of the neoprene foam collars.  It seals it perfectly.

  Blue
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Posted Reply with quote  #90 
Frank, did you get your cloner online, I tried to get a 64 of that brand but they have been out for some time.
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Posted Reply with quote  #91 
Matt - Nice job on the cloner.  I ran the the wire for the pump and 2 air hoses through one of the inserts.  No leaks.  Worked out nice.

AC01.jpg AC02.jpg 

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Posted Reply with quote  #92 
Thanks Frank

Blue/Danny - I thought about that, but then I lose 1 site that could be used for a fig...hehe. I will ultimately do that though. Danny - your setup looks great and i believe it will be leak free if done that way as opposed to notching near the lid. Guess it will be a 24 site cloner unless i can find a old pair of flipflops that i can make an insert with for the plug wires ;)

[DSC013103] 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nycfig
Matt - Nice job on the cloner.  I ran the the wire for the pump and 2 air hoses through one of the inserts.  No leaks.  Worked out nice.

AC01.jpg AC02.jpg 


thanks dude!
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Matt - Long Island - Zone 7B
Wishlist: CDD Roja, Planera, CDD Rimada

Please use the following thread if your growing my "unknown Sheepshead" to track your progress.
http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/saved-brooklyn-tree-unknown-sheepshead-community-growlog-7808733?pid=1290171384
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Posted Reply with quote  #93 
Ha! I'm glad to see many friends are making these cloners. They are very easy to make. The hardest part to making it getting the spray nozzles to seat. I did use a tap with mine. It was too hard to press them in by hand. Once you start rooting cuttings in them, you won't go back to rooting the old way. The fresher the cutting the faster they root. Enjoy !
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Posted Reply with quote  #94 

  As so many of us are building these cloners, and building on one another's successes and failures...  I wanted to alert others of a weak link.

  I purchased a timer for the pump;  a GE 15153, a 40 minute repeat cycle timer:  " #1 Timer for Hydroponic EZCloner"

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Repeat-Cycle-Timer-40min-Hydroponic-Aeroponic-EZcloner-/301819272889?hash=item4645d49eb9:g:0vIAAOSwbqpTzk4~




[GE%2015153_zps7lgx4bne] 


   
  It only lasted four days.  The motor is still running, but you can hear the gears are stripped inside, and the face will not turn.   Even though they tout a "1 year No Hassle Guarantee" ,  that doesn't help me when the poor roots dry out over night because I am not alerted that the pump isn't cycling on.   Lucky for me, the gears stripped in the ON position, so the 100's of dollars of cuttings were spared.  I went back to the old Intermatic workhorse:

  http://www.ebay.com/itm/121837140086?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT


  Blue
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Posted Reply with quote  #95 
You can build one of the eBay timers yourself.  Looks like a simple process:
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Posted Reply with quote  #96 

  Thanks, Danny...  modifying a timer is indeed much simpler than even assembling the cloner, once you have the secret to the gear mods.

   Blue
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Posted Reply with quote  #97 
Hydro farm makes a nice looking dual outlet timer that does 15 minutes on and 15 minutes off and costs around $14.00 . What is the consensus on that time frame for rooting?
Nice video find Danny.
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Posted Reply with quote  #98 
Am I glad I tuned in to this thread. I have had a cloner in my cart on Amazon for over a month now

This morning Santa came calling. I purchased a TurboKlone T24 Aeroponic Cloning System with 24 Site Kloners, a Titan Controls 702740 Apollo 2 Day and Night Cycle Timer with Photocell (recommended by another figger), some Z7 Enzyme Cleanser, 8-Ounce (popular in the marijuana cloner's world), and a General Hydroponics GH1514 Ph Control Kit.

I debated on the Clone King but finally decided on the T24 due to its low water volumne reservoir. I also opted out of the humidity dome. I figured I could rig something in the form of a tent from dry cleaniny bags if it comes to needing more humidity.

Thank you guys for this thread. It's been a great read.
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Posted Reply with quote  #99 
Quote:
Originally Posted by waynea
Frank, did you get your cloner online, I tried to get a 64 of that brand but they have been out for some time.


Hey, Sorry Wayne...Did not see your question until today! Yes, I got mine on eBay, It arrived yesterday.
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Frank from Bama-  Zone 7-b Alabama

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Posted Reply with quote  #100 
Thanks Frank. Have to get me one.
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