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dwarf varieties

dear fignuts!

which varieties do you consider as dwarf? (compared to other figs at the same age and grown under same conditions)
pierre baud lists the following three as 2,5-4m diamter and 2-3m height:

dalmatie (2 crops: 120-150g, 100-120g)
pastiliere (1 crop: 50-60g)
doree (2 crops: 100g, 70-80g)

please add your experiences to this dwarf list!


Dwarf if probably a synonym for slow less-vigorous growing. Size control is more a matter of pruning.

I'm glad you posted this question because I have been wondering the same thing i.e. do bona fide dwarf varieties exist or is it really just different growth rates?  Violette de Bordeaux is often referred to as a dwarf variety but mine is too young to judge so far.  Blackjack is also supposed to be a dwarf.

Personally i do not care for the name dwarf .

Jon hit the fig on the head when he types
 Dwarf if probably a synonym for slow less-vigorous growing.

Will such a  fig tree always stay small  .... no.

 But with proper limb and root pruning growing in a container the grower can always keep them the size they prefer along with shape of tree.

In my yard my Negretta is of the slower growers but for its size it produced good amount of ripe figs.
Will it get big ? In short yes if i let it.

My edible landscaping Violet de Bordeaux is by no means a slow grower i would like to add and is one great tasting fig here in my yard grown in a container such as i do .


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I've been looking for a dwarf fig for years and years, it's a myth. As Jon mentioned, it's more a cultural thing, pot size restriction and pruning and growth rate.  

Good to know - thanks!  I had been thinking of moving a fig I put in the ground in a tight space last summer and replacing it with a VdB which I understood to be a dwarf.  Now I'll leave it be and focus on pruning.

call it as you like...
sure slow growing varieties look dwarf and dwarf varieties are slow growing.
small sized fig trees dont grow 2m in one season and then stop growing for the next years.
I have an old ronde de bordeaux in my garden, it's definitely not suited for small spaces, even with pruning. its HUGE. baud lists RdB as 5-7m in diameter and 3-5m in height.

I consider dwarf figs as slow growing but healthy(no FMV) with short internodes, and therefore bearing good crops. lets add such figs to my list!

Alan types-Dwarf can mean many things it can mean that it can be pruned aggressively and kept in a pot. Some trees no matter how much they are pruned they can not be kept in a pot.

Alan im not flaming your post but that statement in my opinion is false.  Any fig tree i ever grew could grow and be pruned in a container.
Unless you talking about a fig tree that gets to be very very old and starts to get the girth of a street tree then thats the exception. I will most certainly be dead by the time that happens in my containers.
I kindly ask what type of fig tree have you had this experience with ?

Alan types -
Lots of fig tree root systems can not deal with being in a pot. In a barrel yes yet in a pot no.

Alan thats false -
 its up to the grower to properly root and limb prune there trees and not let them get to the point of suffer after 2 or 3 years when most need root pruning.
Sure some are more aggressive such as the Mission and Ronde which i have both but the grower must intervene or the tree will start to display poor performance and eventual fast decline.

Quinoah types -
I have an old ronde de bordeaux in my garden, it's definitely not suited for small spaces, even with pruning. its HUGE.

Quinoah - it is huge because you let it get that way.  ; ) You can most certainly cut it inches from the soil level if you want and it will grow back .
It is perfectly fine growing in a pot as i have several of them.  ; )

In short its up to the grower to root prune and limb prune when growing a fig tree in a container and not let it get out of hand.

  I talk from my growing experience and not simply from reads in a book  and do not want the young members here getting advice that scare them or points them in the wrong direction .



Two Black Madiera trees at the UC Davis orchard are considered a dwarf tree. They are only 6' tall. Howard the care taker of the figs refer to it as a dwarf fig. It is definitely a small tree but I think it is more due to its FMV infection.

I agree with Jon, it's the vigor the determines the tree size. 

My Madeira is a  Ucdavis specimen and stand over 3 feet now and has laughed at the FMV .
The FMV will always be there but it does not hamper its growth at all only its first season when it died down in storage quite a bit.
But unlike Ucdavis 6 footer mine is in a pot and should reach 6 foot in 2 more seasons if i dont trim it down.
My cgrowing season is not as long as UcDavis either.  ; )
 

I have never seen a true dwarf F.carica fig.

The closest I have, just mantains a very shallow
(horizontal/weeping) nice-growth in its pot.

It is my Wuhan (SSE-LA MC R 06) fig; org. China.

 

True dwarf specimens for other speices DO exisit!

My Pixie bougainvillea comes to mind...

I had mine pixie in a small pot for many years, and with

very little pruning  it is still a ~12" tall nice shaped tree.

One time I had about a dozen of a bougainvillea collection,

some I know what I am talking about...

Wow, what a subject. This has brought out the big guns. So with my little cap pistol I would like to offer you my understanding of dwarfing. Dwarfing is commonly stated as a plant that is significantly smaller than standard members of their species. Significantly and standard being the questionable words. This being said dwarfing occurs from multiple situations.

1.    When plants are placed under stress such as soil quality, lack of light, drought , flood, infection, proper or improper pruning to both above and below ground growth, and other environmental constraints. This includes growing in a container which constricts the environment. These types of situations result in what is commonly called a stunted plant. The plant is stunted by hormones reacting to the environment. Taken to an extreme it is called bonsai. Further, each fig will react uniquely to stresses according to it's own genetics. This is not a dwarf. This is dwarf like.

2.    Plants are dwarfed by selective propagation, grafting, and hormones  http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/hs221 . As with citrus the next time you eat a store bought apple it will be highly probable that it came from a dwarf apple tree. 

I have not seen a dwarf fig tree. I have seen fig trees shorter at maturity than others at maturity according to their own genetics. To truly have a dwarf I believe you would need to graft a known large fig tree cutting to a known small tree root stock and with the same equal environmental conditions see if the tree is smaller at maturity. 

I grow my figs in containers.  


Perhaps a way for to say .
Like Gorgi i have never seen a dwarf fig tree .
The figs tree's do grow at different rates though some grow more slower than others is best way i could personally explain it growing in my containers.

For example 2 extremes i mention here..
Ronde de Bordeaux - grew like a weed very fast and easily outgrew negretta it first season in life.

Negretta  - grew very slow but grows albeit slower than any fig plant in my yard.
Me personally its not a dwarf in terms as in years to come if i let it the size will steadliy increase just at a slower pace.


Sorry if i repeat myself in thread .
Signs are pointing to a early or on time spring for me here.

Trees as a whole are limited in size by gravity and their own ability to pump water to their tops. Just sayin.

here is one "dwarf" variety for sale

Sicilian Miniature
A bonsai variety that produces an abundant crop of excellent quality figs.
This is one of the most prolific figs to grow in cold areas of the north.The fall fruits are born on the new canes that
grow during the summer a plant with 4 new stem growths can produce up to 150 purple figs. Self- pollinating. Does not require special treatment. Very Prolific. Zone 6-11


$
34.95    
 



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dieseler
In short its up to the grower to root prune and limb prune when growing a fig tree in a container and not let it get out of hand.

 

Martin, I think a lot of us would like your advice on the best way to limb prune for containers.  There's been a lot on root pruning but nothing on limb pruning for containers.  There may be a hundred ways but tell us how you do it please  :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoosierbanana
Trees as a whole are limited in size by gravity and their own ability to pump water to their tops.
 
Water only goes up 33 feet by capillary action.  Taller trees generally get their moisture from the air.

this is from Wikipedia:

Quote:
Transpirational pull results from the evaporation of water from the surfaces of cells in the leaves. This evaporation causes the surface of the water to recess into the pores of the cell wall. By capillary action, the water forms concave menisci inside the pores. The high surface tension of water pulls the concavity outwards, generating enough force to lift water as high as a hundred meters from ground level to a tree's highest branches.

Transpiration in leaves creates tension (differential pressure) in the mesophyll cells. Because of this tension, water is literally being pulled up from the roots into the leaves, helped by cohesion (the pull between individual water molecules, due to hydrogen bonds) and adhesion (the stickiness between water molecules and the hydrophilic cell walls of plants).

I dont know all that much about it but did pay attention most of the time in Bio and remember the cohesion and hydrogen bond bits. I am sure atmospheric moisture helps trees use less water, but is has to actually move up from the roots in order to cool the leaves and transfer nutrients.


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