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good size container.

what is a good size container for fully growng fig trees? i know bigger the better. but i'm only keeping the best ones in 10 gal. and that's the largest i want to go.

 

the question is.. what is the smallest size container that full grown fig will be productive. 5 gal? 3-4 gal? or 10 gal is the smallest they will be happy in?

 

White Greek is putting on figs this year. it's in 3 gal pot. i'm going to move it to 10 gal pot this fall or next spring. but with other figs that doesn't make the cut, should i keep them in 3 gal? would that still produce figs? i'm not looking for large harvest at all. 10-20 a tree will be more than enough for me. if the taste is superb, they will get bumped to 10 gal.

 

first 4 fig trees that i have are special to me, so they go/stay in 10 gal. they are VdB, Paradiso Gene, KB, and WG.

 

pete

Pete the Bullet....

Here's an idea...

Home Depot sells rectangular, 18 gallon storage tubs that can easily be converted to large growing containers by drilling holes into the bottom/sides.  Very inexpensive too,.... heavy duty, and come with side handles.  They also fit perfectly on a dolly so you could just roll your trees around to where you want them.  The best part is that they have straight rims, and  sides, so that plants can be placed next to each other without loosing room like round containers create.  You could fit more fig trees in a given area, and in neat rows.  When these containers are filled with medium they will probably hold between 10-15 gallons of medium because you will not fill the containers to the very top, leaving space for watering without run-off.

I have started to switching my trees into these containers, and find them much easier to handle, and shift around because of the handles.  The capacity is ideal, and they could be stacked, easier into two tiers if needed with the top containers resting in the rims of the four bottom containers.  This last part may not be too clear, and I hope you get the picture in your head of just what I mean.  Four containers  on the bottom row, and the 5th resting in the middle of the four, but on top....like a pyramid.

Hope this might help.

Frank

Hi Frank,
how long have you been using the tubs? Do you know how long they last, years-wise?
I'm headed to the HD today, I'll have to take a look.

John

i've been using 10 gal round tub from HD for last yr or so.. it's serving me fine.. but i'm running out of room. i'm thinking about 5 gal bucket and going self watering. but 25 of 5 gal bucket is a lot of 'em. running out of room really quick specially during the winter when i put them all into the garage..

 

pete

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  • FMD

Pete, friendly warning regarding figs in SIPS (sub-irrigated planters ). Just my opinion based personal experience.

One to two years in a SIP is great, but the roots will take over the water reservoir filling it completely at which point you will need to water constantly...especially in the hot South.

Others will disagree with me.



FMD,

 

in case of using "Global Bucket", shouldn't it be avoidable if the set up is inspected occationally? it looks easy enough to pull the top bucket up to check on the roots..  i guess root prune and root work is necessary once in awhile also..

 

pete

I think 10g is to small. I would bee looking at 15g minimum on up to something like 30g. 10g does not get you a lot of tree.

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  • FMD

Pete, the global bucket model allows only for a relatively tiny reservoir of water, which means you will be watering frequently from the gitgo. Fig roots are extremely aggressive and will grow through any crevice towards the water including the wicking compartment and the wicking medium. Pulling the two buckets apart is easier said than done especially with a heavy tree growing out of the top bucket.

I know that there are a couple of members here that are doing well using this system, but both live in the North where the growing season is much shorter and growth less aggressive than in the South. Speaking from experience, you will get phenomenal growth during the first year but is not sustainable in subsequent years due to the above discussed phenomenon. When I threw in the towel, root growth was such that I had to destroy the buckets in order to extricate/salvage the tree.

Still, as they say in the weight loss infomercials, " Results may vary".


John, and others....

I've been growing in the HD tubs for the last few years, and they have shown no signs of oxidizing, or getting brittle...yet.  How long they will last...who knows...but for less than $8.00 for a 18 gallon tub, I'll buy another if if breaks down.

The tubs come in larger sizes also, and I would use the larger sizes if I had an unheated garage.  I don't.  I have a skimpy little storage shed, and I have to lift my tubs into the shed...so I can't do a tub that weighs too much.

Since growing in containers means root-pruning every 3-5 years, I will change the tubs for new ones if they start to crack from age, at the same time the roots are pruned.

John, hope this helps.

Frank

Something I wrote and have left on a number of different threads over the years. It may be helpful.

 

Soil choice determines what size pot or what soil volume is appropriate. In particular, the amount of perched water a soil holds governs whether a given soil mass is appropriate for a plant. The more water-retentive the soil is, the more critical the choice. As a soil approaches the point where it holds little or no perched water, there is no upper limit to the soil volume that's appropriate, from the perspective of root health/function.

 

It's important to realize too, that at about the point where the root/soil mass can be lifted from the container intact, root congestion becomes a factor limiting growth and vitality. 

You can put small seedlings in a large volume of well-made gritty or 5:1:1 mix with no problems, but the same can't be said of those soils that support considerable amounts of perched water. For those, if you are concerned about over-potting, you might want to take steps to reduce some of the effects.  

Here is something I wrote that discusses appropriate container size:

How large a container can or should be, depends on the relationship between the mass of the plant material you are working with and your choice of soil. We often concern ourselves with "over-potting" (using a container that is too large), but "over-potting" is a term that arises from a lack of a basic understanding about the relationship we will look at, which logically determines appropriate container size.

It's often parroted that you should only move up one container size when "potting-up". The reasoning is, that when potting up to a container more than one size larger, the soil will remain wet too long and cause root rot issues, but it is the size/mass of the plant material you are working with, and the physical properties of the soil you choose that determines both the upper & lower limits of appropriate container size - not a formulaic upward progression of container sizes. In many cases, after root pruning a plant, it may even be appropriate to step down a container size or two, but as you will see, that also depends on the physical properties of the soil you choose.

Plants grown in slow (slow-draining/water-retentive) soils need to be grown in containers with smaller soil volumes so that the plant can use water quickly, allowing air to return to the soil before root issues beyond impaired root function/metabolism become a limiting factor. We know that the anaerobic (airless) conditions that accompany soggy soils quickly kill fine roots and impair root function/metabolism. We also know smaller soil volumes and the root constriction that accompany them cause plants to both extend branches and gain o/a mass much more slowly - a bane if rapid growth is the goal - a boon if growth restriction and a compact plant are what you have your sights set on.

Conversely, rampant growth can be had by growing in very large containers and in very fast soils where frequent watering and fertilizing is required - so it's not that plants rebel at being potted into very large containers per se, but rather, they rebel at being potted into very large containers with a soil that is too slow and water-retentive. This is a key point.

We know that there is an inverse relationship between soil particle size and the height of the perched water table (PWT) in containers. As particle size increases, the height of the PWT decreases, until at about a particle size of just under 1/8 inch, soils will no longer hold perched water. If there is no perched water, the soil is ALWAYS well aerated, even when the soil is at container capacity (fully saturated).

So, if you aim for a soil (like the gritty mix) composed primarily of particles larger than 1/16", there is no upper limit to container size, other than what you can practically manage. The lower size limit will be determined by the soil volume's ability to allow room for roots to 'run' and to furnish water enough to sustain the plant between irrigations. Bearing heavily on this ability is the ratio of fine roots to coarse roots. It takes a minimum amount of fine rootage to support the canopy under high water demand. If the container is full of large roots, there may not be room for a sufficient volume of the fine roots that do all the water/nutrient delivery work and the coarse roots, too. You can grow a very large plant in a very small container if the roots have been well managed and the lion's share of the rootage is fine. You can also grow very small plants, even seedlings, in very large containers if the soil is fast (free-draining and well-aerated) enough that the soil holds no, or very little perched water.

I have just offered clear illustration that the oft repeated advice to 'only pot up one size at a time', only applies when using heavy, water-retentive soils. Those using well-aerated soils are not bound by the same restrictions.

 

Al

What an idiot I am!!!! 

I forgot to mention the most important part of my containerized growing strategy...I grow all my plant, and FIG TREES in the quick-draining mix....you know, the Turface-MVP, Pine Bark Fines, Gravel medium.

Thank-you Al for the potting medium explanation.

At the next root-pruning of my trees, they will go into fresh, new mix, and re-potted back into the same containers.

Frank

Hi Pete,
I have a tree in a pot 13 inches diameter, by about 12 inches deep.
I don't know off hand what that is in gallons, probably less than 10.
It has about 30 main crop figs on it now.
So 10 gallon pot should do fine for the results you have descriped.

Grant
z5b


Grant,

More than likely, I'll stay with 10 gal for older trees, and 5 gal for new ones. If I really like the tree, they'll go to 10 or max at 20. At most I'll have 5 in 10 gal.

Few of better figs might go into 20 gal decorated container to the from of the house.

Just not enough space...

Pete

Volume of a cylinder(pot) = ( pi )  X (radius of pot, squared) X (height) = volume in cubic inches.

Divide this cubic inch result by 231 for liquid gallons
Divide this cubic inch result by 271 for dry (medium/mix/soil) gallons.

The second choice will tell you the capacity for your pots.

Volume for rectangular/square containers = area X height = cubic inches.  Divide either by 231, or 271 for gallons...wet/dry.

Use 3.14 for pi

For example:    Pot 13" diameter by 12' deep

Volume in cubic inches= (3.14)  X  (6.5 X 6.5)  X (12) = 1591 cubic inches

1591/271= 5.874 gallons...almost 6 gallons of soil/growing medium....less because we do not fill pots to the top rim...so this is more like a 5 gallon pot.

Sorry, if this is unclear.  The important part is finding the volume of your container in cubic inches, then dividing this figure by 271 for getting dry gallons of capacity.

Hope this might be useful.

Frank

Thanks for the math lesson Frank.

Grant
z5b

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  • BLB

I suck at math. I just look at the label or pot markings to deterimine size, then estmate with improvised pots made out of containers other than pots designed for horticulture. Do it enough times and you can eyeball your pots and know the aproximate size. Close enough for jazz and growing figs

That was awesome Frank all is numbers

I either guesstimate or eyeball it. Exact measurement is for pastry chefs.

Pete

Frank, you are the MAN!!!! I have these large pots and I was trying to compare the size to Bill's. According to the math, mine are 20gal size and I am very happy. I'm getting ready convert them to SIPs. Many thanks Frank!!!

I got the equations.
I didn't know there were wet/dry gallon measurements in the US tho.

Frank, I like the idea of using the rectangle tubs space wise.  How do the roots handle hitting the corners?  As far as avoiding the brittleness on plastic containers, I use Turtle Wax Ice.  It is a car wax that has uv protection and doesn't discolor plastics.


My current plans for any trees not going into the ground is half 55gal barrels.  I may do self watering, not sure yet.

I hope you can use these cubic inch conversions to gallons (dry) to judge the capacity of your containers if they are not marked with a volume designation.  These are only approximations, and do not take into account any tapered sides or  tapered cylinders...but, it's good enough for jazz, as one poster notes.

Wet gallons measure liquids, dry gallons measure anything other than liquids...for example:....dry growing mediums, soils, etc.  This conversion should be used for our growing containers.

****************************************************************

noss.....

The extra Turface will keep the soil mix even wetter...it is absorbent, and retains water.  If you PM tapla (Al) maybe he can recommend a different proportion of ingredients for your growing conditions.


Happy growing....now you'll know the capacity of your containers.  No more guessing.

Frank

I have been doing SIPs this year with positive results. They are doing construction around my office so getting 50+ buckets has been free and easy. I got around the limited amount of water from stacking 2 buckets by stacking 3 buckets. The middle bucket has been cut in half so the top bucket has access to about 2.5 gallons of water instead of the gallon or so in a normal Global Bucket. You may also notice that I have a black connector for a drip watering system that I glued into the bottom, in this way I have connected 5 individual containers together so they all share water. I can add water to the buckets individually oreventually the plan is to hook the 1/4 inch drip tube up to a rain barrel watersupply so that I really don't have to worry about watering again. These pictures are for my first string. My figs are in the back yard in a similar setup but I just don't have any pictures in their homes yet. I used a smaller bit than global buckets recommended but drilled more holes to compensate for drainage. As you can see I also used synthetic rope for wicks instead of using soil as a wicking medium.

 

If I have a lot of growth with my figs in this setup then I know I am going to have to repot and root prune but I want to get them set up and established nicely first.

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by r3tic
 As far as avoiding the brittleness on plastic containers, I use Turtle Wax Ice.  It is a car wax that has uv protection and doesn't discolor plastics.

 

That's interesting. Do you know how long is it effective before having to apply it again?I have some square pots that are about 15 gallon, that I think that might help. Other than standard black nursery pots, I've had bad luck with plastic containers in the sun.

r3tic/Dennis....

I've experienced no problems.  Root just follow shape of container.  Roots will be pruned away by 1/3 - 1/2 every 3-5 years,...I doubt root systems in rectangular containers will cause concern.

Thanks for the UV protection tips by using Turtle Wax.  I will coat my containers.

Thanks,

Frank

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