To those that have actually used these pots, would you recommend them?

Trying to weed through the advertising. 

How long did they last for you?

Did you have to change growing media due to water evaporation?

Overall perception of air pruning pots is appreciated.

Thanks

I have used fabric pots for 2 or 3 years.  Here are my observations:

1. They do air root prune somewhat and reduce circling significantly.  Not sure it goes away alltogether though.
2. Roots will grow through the fabric on the bottom and into the soil, sometimes.  However, there is a limit to how large the root can get unless it manages to snake its way through a seam.  Not necessarily a bad thing.  Tells me the root pruning is probably working.
3. It can be a challenge to keep them moist.  On the other hand, if you overwater, the excess will likely wick out the bottom or evaporate.
4. I don't recommend using any kind of gritty or coarse mix in these.  When I used the pine bark fines 5-1-1 mix, it tended to dry out and stay that way.  Due to wicking properties and breathable fabric all around, I suspect there are fewer reasons for a coarse mix.
5. If you store your pots in a garage during the winter, make sure you give these more water than a regular pot.  I had 4 casualties this winter (none due to low temps) due to the fabric pots drying out. 
6. Most of mine are still plenty strong and I would expect at least 2 more seasons out of them, possibly much more. 
7. I have some 20 gallon with no handles.  Those are exceptionally difficult to get a grip on and move.  Anything large would require some sort of dolly or forklift.
8. It can be hard to get the root ball out of the pot when it's time to up-pot.  The roots will attach to the pot as they try to grow through it.  Kind of like pulling ivy off a tree.  If I get too frustrated I just cut the pot.  In particular I am not sure how I'm going to get the tree to come out of the 20 gallon pot due to its weight/size, etc.  The smaller ones can be coaxed out eventually.

Would I recommend them?  Yes, but not necessarily any more than a standard pot.  Each one has its pros and cons.  The jury is still out on the 20 gallon though.  I'm hoping to be able to leave the fig trees in that size pot for several seasons with less need for re-potting compared to a plastic pot.  Time will tell if this works.  At the end of the day, one of the most arduous parts of pot culture is re-potting and root pruning.  If I can avoid or delay this, it will be worth it.

I'd also add to Rob's thorough analysis that fabric pots tend to be waaaay cheaper to ship.

It is funny how we see things differently.  This is my second year with RootPouches.  I use a 2:1:1 (bark, perlite, shale) mix.  My solution to drying out and excessive heat was to bump up a size rather than change mixes.  As it is warming up, I am planning on constructing a sleeve for the containers out of aluminum flashing.  As Rob pointed out, it is important to not let them dry out.  If they do, dunk them in a bucket of water almost to the top of the growing mix for a few minutes.

I have also used the Super-Root Airpots.  I think I prefer them to the fabric containers.  If I had purchased the 1 gallon ones back when they were still cheap, I would not use the fabric containers.

The main thing for central Texas is the intense sun and heat.  It is very hard on the roots of containerized plants.  The best thing you can do for any container is to make sure it (or a surrounding sleeve) is opaque and reflective.  I would also recommend watering later in the afternoon.

I'll sell you mine.  I used them for potting up cuttings from bags.  I poured water in an empty 1 gal.  They held the water (at least at first) so I punched holes in the bottom.  They dried out too fast with pro-mix HP so I added pine bark.  Roots still circled, plus they came out the holes and seams.  Then I found that the pine bark in my regular pots was holding a ton of water in the bottom so I went back to regular pots with PM HP only and that worked fine.

I use the 20 gallon tan with handles, cheapest I could find on the internet shipped at $16.25 each.  I have Fruit trees in them, peaches, nectarines, and plums. Starting in March of this year with a 5-1-1 mix.  I have spit spotter irrigation running 6 mins every 4 hours, really to cool things off more than watering, the good things is the wicking so I don't overwater. I also have 5 and 7 gallon bags. I definitely recommend nothing less than 15 gallons, my grapes are growing great in the 7 gallons but my goal is for root mass vs actually goring grapes this year. I had  fig in a 10 gallon and moved up to a 15 gallon pot.  All in all I can say they work really well well established roots, but my favorite is the air pot.

Here are some grapes in a 7 gallon smart pot started from the cuttings you buy at  walmart, I planted it from dormancy in April.
 
 
Fig in a 10 gallon
 

15 Gallon Air Pot
 
two year olds cuttings started in 3 gallon airpot finished off in a homemade airpot
 
#2 Finished off in a 5 gallon SIP w/tomatillo plant
   
4 month old cutting in 3 gallon airpot
 

$5.00 12" whip from lows now 5 month old in homemade airpot
 
 
 
6" cutting now 3 months old started in a 3 gallon airpot potted up last week to 5 gallon, 100% coco coir producing 2 figs
 

IMHO Air-Pots if you can afford them, but homemade ones work just as good, 5-1-1 or 100% coco coir has worked for me.  

I knew I'd get great replies, I appreciate the detail, and pictures.  

Can one use weed barrier to make a home made one?  While reading these I thought of combining sleeve concept with home made pot idea.  The Sleeve could be lumber, or if you have access to it aluminum, as James suggested, and the weed barrier "pot" could line this sleeve, even slide out independently.

James I am surprised your mix isn't drying out too quickly, I believe you, but how often do you water?  I like the idea of a very fast draining media and water frequently, sorta like hydroponics with a weak nutrient solution applied at each watering, or once a week, and regular watering in between.  

I go back and forth between something like air pots, and wicking.  I just up-potted my figs to 5 gallon plastic and 511 mix because that's what I have.  Mixing everything, Man, that was work.  I'm not sure how you guys with lots do it.  Definitely labor of love.

Pwbum1- I like your clever idea of hanging the grapes, looks cool.  Your figs are the best advertising for the air pot concept, very nice!

James--Re-read, Yes flashing is inexpensive, and easy to obtain.  Let me know how it works out.

I think the airpots are good for the moderate climate. I cannot imagine one in the hot SoCal climate.

Just about all of my trees are in Root Pouches or SIPs. I've been using a combination of Pro-Mix HP and MG Moisture Control, that's been working pretty well. The Root Pouches do give a nice bushy rootball, but are a pain to up-pot, since the roots do grow into the container. It helps to use a knife or trowel around the edge of the pot first. If you go with those, I highly recommend ordering from Greenhouse Megastore. Along with individual pouches they sell in packs of 10 or 25, depending on the size, which makes them very affordable.

To James point regarding moisture and sun exposure, If a small fabric pot (less than 5 gallons) is allowed to sit in direct sun I think it bakes out the moisture and the pine bark can get this strange consistency and smell that reminds me of some fungus along with this really light color, almost yellow.  At that point it really does not take moisture at all, even if you were to dunk it, and there aren't any roots in there.  If you protect it from the sun or if it is large enough to have some thermal mass and resist the baking, probably wouldn't happen. 

I bought 20 gallon pouches, and I'm sure I didn't pay anywhere near $16.25 apiece.  Don't recall where I got them.  Maybe GH megastore

I do think you could make your own out of landscape fabric or something similar.  In fact thought about doing it by buying those tubes they use to contain runoff.  But in the end wouldn't have saved that much money (maybe only 15%), and I don't currently have a sewing machine.  You could probably use old XXL t-shirts with the sleeves and neck tied off, but they would likely only last a season.  There is no limit to what someone with imagination could produce cheaply.  Some people use those wal-mart shopping bags, but they're nowhere near 20 gallons.  Probably more like 5 or 10.  But definitely cheap.  And if you have to cut them up to up-pot, who cares?

I bought a bunch, 50, I think, of #1 Airpots (.8 gal) a few years ago thinking to use them during the rooting process and for starting fruit trees of other stripes from rootstock. I used them for a couple of years and now they sit on a shelf taking up space. As many have mentioned, drying out of the growing medium was the big issue for me. I don't recall if I lost trees (probably one or three), but I am certain that the challenges of keeping things moist enough for happy roots stunted the growth of my trees. On the other hand, the roots sure looked great coming out of the containers when I potted them up.

Moving to a more moisture-retentive mixture would help, but as greenfig noted, in a hot, dry, desert environment, and Reno's high desert describes that nicely, Airpots are probably not the best way to nurture your tree's root system. I'd practically have to grow in clay to keep from watering two or three times a day during the heat of summer if the pots were in full sun. Not ideal under any circumstances.

I think in more humid environments the Airpots can work well given a few tweaks to your normal growing medium. We've already seen the evidence on this thread. I'll make a good deal on my Airpots for anybody interested in acquiring them. PM me and we'll discuss terms.

bump on an old thread....


I'm interested in learning more from other members that have tried the smart pots/DIY smart pots using landscaping fabric.

My questions are:
1.  Who has tried this?
2.  Is it worth it over just purchasing smart pots/regular containers?
3.  If tried, what fabric/product did you use and what weight was the material it?
4.  If a DIY, how did you construct it (sewing, stapling, folding, etc)?
5.  What is the optimal potting mix for water retention?
6.  How well did up-potting go when the tree needed to be removed from a smaller fabric container to a larger one?
7.  How did you store your tree during the winter and did you need to water it?
8.  Would you do it again?


Also I've noted several owners grow their trees in containers with holes drilled in the sides to promote oxygenation.  What are the pros/cons to doing this?

Thanks.


 

In the hot desert, previous home, we had an entire vineyard in Sun Leaves Grow Bags.  The bags last one year, but the amount of roots in the ball was amazing with NO circling at all!  The reflective white and dark insides helps with the heat, but we also put them under the canopy of in-ground vines.  Our bags were filled with Al's Gritty mix specifically formulated for hot desert regions, and all were on drip systems.

I often punched more holes in the bags for extra root pruning, a concept in which I completely belived

All have been moved here to our new property and put in-ground.  Now we have land.  No need for bags.

Suzi

I like large grow bags (5 gallons plus), but not small ones.  I have some 2 gallon grow bags, and while it does prevent root circling, I also think it dries out very quickly.  I have some 10 and 20 gallon grow bags, and I think they are great.  The only problem I'm noticing is that rodents will chew large holes in them.  That reduces their lifespan a lot more than the elements will.  Even so, I will keep using them.  The boxer brown root pouches are supposed to last forever.  I think they will last a long time in the elements but rodents will still chew them up, potentially. 

It is difficult to get the trees out of the grow bags, so I really figure them to be permanent homes.  I figure if I go to 20 gallon grow bags I won't have to re-pot for many years, since the roots don't circle.  At that point if I have to cut it up to get the tree out, I can live with that.

One more thing on the small grow bags.  If you store your pots in your garage in the winter, be careful using the fabric grow bags, because they will dry out a lot faster than plastic.  I lost a half dozen trees in 2 gallon grow bags this winter due not to cold damage but dryness.  If I had know I would have just watered them more often.  I did not lose any of my other trees in either plastic pots the same size, or larger fabric pots. 

I moved recently and put bare-root fig trees into 10 gallon Smart Pots [brown colored mesh bags. So far I like them.

I have limited growing area that is not yet set up, so as an interim measure I placed them in an area that gets maybe 4 hours of sunlight/day, about at the drip line of a landscaping tree. Not optimal amount of sunlight but for the rest of this season, it will have to do. At least they seem healthy. They are watered via drip irrigation, which I tapped off of a sprinkler line. 

After having read this thread, I went outside to check on my fig trees, I began pulling up on the edge of one Smart Pot, but heard and felt what seemed similar to Velcro being pulled apart.
I think a well distributed amount of fine root hairs have grown through the bag to the open earth below. A slight tug on another Smart Pot produced the same results.  So, it seems the fig trees are getting extra nutrients from the earth, while the landscaping tree is getting extra water. Both parties seem happy about this situation. 

I used mostly fabric containers this year, rooting containers included. Most were homemade, sewn using outdoor thread from 3 pieces of fabric. Ball point needle (it took a while to figure that out ; )

Half gallon DIY, spun landscape fabric 4"x 4"x 8"- Will not repeat. They are hit of miss, some plants had good root systems throughout but most only had good roots at the bottom. Trouble with keeping moisture even, need to be massed together initially and that can cause roots to grow down the sides.

One Gallon DIY 6"x 6"x 6", spun lanscape fabric and the premium rubberized spun stuff- Much better results, able to achieve better growth than rooting in standard one gallon containers.

2 gal DIY 6"x 6"x 12", spun landscape fabric- Fine results so far, extra water needed compared to square shape, have not moved to larger pots yet. 

3 gal  9"x 9"x 9" DIY spun and rubberized premium- Works great, I was amazed that cuttings could be rooted in such large containers (although it was many days in between watering). Have not uppotted any yet (that is the idea ; )

3 Gal root pouch, black. OK, I don't like the folded bottom but can't complain yet, they seem to dry faster than my cubes.

7 gallon cube 1'x 1'x 1' DIY spun landscape fabric- They work fine. Have only repotted a couple from last year but they seem good.

Have also purchased root pouches in 10, 15, and 25 gallon size. They are much nicer than mine, the handles are not quite strong enough. Material is very sturdy, grey, brown.

I found coco coir to be the best for even water retention, added 10-15% perlite. Promix BX is too dense. Best custom mix was roughly 4 parts Promix Organik MP, one pine bark, one coir, one perlite.

I always lose some roots at the bottom but have not noticed any extra stress because of it. It takes a little longer being careful...

p.s. I plant to pack them tight in storage to reduce drying.