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RIMike

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Posted Reply with quote  #51 
OK, so here is an update. Cuttings of VDB and Black Madeira ( Thanks Mario ) cuttings were put in the cloner using just plain water and stuck under the T5 Grow lights on January 24th.

cloner.jpg 

Here is the inside of the clone machine. Nothing special, just some 360 degree spray heads running off a small pump.
cloner2.jpg 

Here's whats happening underneath.
cloner3.jpg 

Appears to be not much, but closer inspection of the Black Madeira I've got the beginning of roots!!! cloner4.jpg 

Looks like the VDB are starting to form roots as well. cloner5.jpg 

So that's 6 days sitting under a T5 400Watt growl light that's on 12hrs a day, and the clone machine runs 24/7 with just plain water. No cloning gel, no hormone dip, just tap water out of the faucet. Needless to say I'm beyond impressed with this method. No more rotten cuttings, wet moss, plastic bags and perlite, etc. This works system works, and works amazingly well. Build one, or buy one with all the parts ready to go, it doesn't matter as the concept is the same. I bought this one as I didn't feel like hunting around for all the parts to build one as the cost is the end was about the same.

Could the be a world record for getting a Black Madeira cutting to show roots?

OK, now who has some blueberry bush cuttings they don't need? :)

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Posted Reply with quote  #52 
RIMike, Nice progress!
Does anyone have any comments on the pros and cons of leaving more of the cutting down in the rooting chamber?  When I do rooting and pot up, I tend to try to bury extra nodes to encourage more roots to grow out of the buried portion of the cutting....and as insurance for any future cold-related die-back catastrophes.  If there's more cutting down in the misting chamber, there's more liklihood of starting off with more roots over a greater section of the cutting...
Jim
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Posted Reply with quote  #53 
I have a cloner like Mike also but think I like the fog better.  Like Sharon commented on, the fog vapor wasn't uniformly distributed so I added a 12 volt waterproof fan a couple of nights ago.  It's range is 6v - 12v and I'm running it at 6v and even that blows more air than is needed.  The fog favor is very uniform now and I'm considering constructing a much larger unit.  The main attraction to these for me is that I don't need to monitor moisture every 2-3 days like I do with the method I have been using in rooting directly in mini-treepots with ProMix HP. [IMAG2735]
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andreas

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Posted Reply with quote  #54 
great job!!!
i wish i could have one here in greece.
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Posted Reply with quote  #55 
Andreas,

I do not think you need one up there! You have the Nature and climate on your side, they are much more powerful!
Those guys are doing some powerful magic things but they are in Rhode Island, NJ and elsewhere behind the Arctic circle :)
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andreas

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Posted Reply with quote  #56 
Igor
you are right my friend but looking at Harveys machine makes me want a new toy.
you guys root year round... i cant even start yet... will do so sometime next week.
i can only root cuttings outside.
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andreas-patras
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Posted Reply with quote  #57 
I am sure many people here would trade your “outside” for their “inside” cloning machine :)
Especially when it is 0 and freezing in their garden !
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Posted Reply with quote  #58 
Hi Harveyc,
Rooting more Panache ? :P
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Posted Reply with quote  #59 
Some of my figs are getting bumps too.  I think they have been slow because things in the basement are cool.  I noticed a few green bumps  on top so added a light and little leaves are growing.
I plan on taking them out as soon as the roots are about 1 inch, putting them in mix and tossing them in the greenhouse.  The folks are starting seed and cutting so the propagation tables are going full blast.  This keeps the humidity very high even with the heaters running.  The plant normally take off as long as I keep them watered.
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Posted Reply with quote  #60 
Show us more pictures when you get 'real' roots.  I'd love it if this works.  :)

It's been a week since the last photo update.  Any roots should have grown to be easier to see by now.  More photos?
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HarveyC

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Posted Reply with quote  #61 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsfrance
Hi Harveyc,
Rooting more Panache ? :P


Special Panache.  These cuttings are from my one branch that produced some variegated leaves. :)  The top bud of each cutting (plus some others) formed next to a variegated leaf.  The 3 shorter cuttings are in the cloner and the 2 longer ones are in ProMix HP.  Fingers crossed.
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RIMike

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Posted Reply with quote  #62 
Ok so here's an update as requested.

I've got more than just figs in here now to see how different things react. Besides the figs, holly, variegated red twig dogwood, Japanese Lilac, and some blueberry bush cuttings. That's all I could find a this time of the year to stick in here.

IMG_0696.JPG 
There doesn't appear to be anything drying out as there was some discussion about a humidity dome in previous posts. You can see some breba starting to form, which I've since knocked off.

I've changed the water earlier in the week. I don't think is a requirement, I was bored and tired of starting at 2ft of snow out every window in the house!
 xlonewash.JPG 
From the looks of things, the greener cuttings seem to be reacting very well to this propagation method, more so than the older brown wood.

Here are some RDB Cuttings
IMG_0700.JPG 

White Triana cuttings here

IMG_0701.JPG 
IMG_0702.JPG 

Here's one of the Black Madeira cuttings

IMG_0703.JPG 

VDB Cuttings from older wood. You can see they are string to show signs.
IMG_0704.JPG   
IMG_0705.JPG    

So far I'm pleased. For the middle of winter, it's working just fine. I'd expect better results with warmer temps that whats happening under the grow lights in the basement. 70 degree water and 75 - 80 degree air temps and I think things would work very well. And for what it's worth, checking them 3, 4, 5 or more times a day doesn't seem to speed up root development.

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Posted Reply with quote  #63 
Yeah, if you want to speed up root growth you have to check them every 15 seconds.   :)  I see lots of lenticels and 2 things that might be roots.  Maybe another photo essay next weekend?  I might be mistaken but it seems the mister at the lower left isn't working and the center mister may not be working well.  Best of luck with them.
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Posted Reply with quote  #64 
Harvey,  when I tested out my setup (to be), I convinced myself I wouldn't need the fan.  I originally thought I would.  But if I left the lid open a crack, mist would come out the top---indicating that mist was reaching all the way to the top.  And at any given moment one area might have slightly thicker mist than another...but there seemed to be enough air movement caused by the splashing of the fogger that it would all even out over time.
  Plus, I really didn't want to spend money on the waterproof fan ;-)
Bob, I would rather spend the fan money on the waterproof web cam that I can mount inside the unit so that I could check the cuttings every 15 seconds (or more).

  I did make one observation about these commander XXL tubs.  The lids fit on the tubs upside down. When oriented this way, there are some parts of the lid that hang down below the inside lip of the tub.  So, IF a humidity dome was needed, and if condensation became a problem, a couple of small holes could be drilled in those low sections to allow the condensate to drain back down into the tub.

Cheers,
Jim
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penandpike

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Posted Reply with quote  #65 
You should cut of the flower buds from the blueberries as well.
And may be you can try using aquarim water heater. You can drop it at the botom of the tank and set a good water temperature. Just a thought.
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Posted Reply with quote  #66 
Mike, yours looks great. If it were me, I'd add a lot more water till it touched the bottom of the manifold. More water means more power and more oxygen in the water. And don't worry if the roots get long and in to the water. Just keep doing what you're doing and everything will root. The roots will become tough, again don't worry. Nice pics!
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needaclone

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Posted Reply with quote  #67 
I just looked at my tub again and the whole "upside down" lid idea is probably not the way to go due to "lock holes" that are in the lid.  When the lid is on correctly, the bulk of the lid sits lower into the tub than when it is upside down, anyway.  (I should have looked at it again before posting.)
I'm getting excited to try mine out.  I have no hydroponics stores nearby, and I finally found a source of 2" netpots that are truly 2" and have a nice, wide lip so the pots don't fall through.

In addition to cutting off the majority of the net pot, do you guys also split the side to make it easier to get off a cutting that has grown a large root mass and has lots of leaves?
Cheers,
Jim
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RIMike

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Posted Reply with quote  #68 
Good observation on the blueberries. I'll do that in the next time I check them....
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schaplin

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Posted Reply with quote  #69 
I split pots to get everything in.  I added a light and am trying ti warm things up a bit.  Might have to get mine off the floor to keep it warmer.  I was originally worried about leaking but so far no issue. 
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Posted Reply with quote  #70 
Jim, I only added the fan after first running the fogger for a week and I noticed some cuttings were not wet on at least one side.  After adding the fan, all of them are wet.  Based on the value of some cuttings, the price of the fan and AC adapter were a minor consideration.  I'm still thinking up a design for a much larger cloner.

My tub is elevated 4" off the floor in a room that is 73-82F (depending on where I shoot my laser thermometer).  I think I want to put it up on a higher shelf so it is warmer or add an aquarium heater.
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needaclone

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Posted Reply with quote  #71 

Harvey,
  The proof is in the pudding -- sounds like the fan is a must have.
Do you have any seedling heating mats?  You could put one underneath the tub.  But all-in-all, the aquarium heater is probably the way to go.  They're made to be submerged in water, after all.
Cheers,Jim
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Posted Reply with quote  #72 
I already have 4 tables 2' x 4' that are using my existing mats but I have considered buying another for a bigger cloner.  Since my wife's beta died some time ago, he no longer needs the aquarium heater. :)
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HarveyC

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Posted Reply with quote  #73 
Here is the most advanced cutting in my cloner after two weeks.  I'm not sure what I will do, but I might just go ahead and plant it soon as the roots will soon be too large to fit through the hole since they're growing straight out like that.

[IMAG2754] 
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rcantor

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Posted Reply with quote  #74 
Now *that's* what I'm talking about!  Harvey, is your mist maker at the bottom or floating?  I wonder if the floating mister will get cuttings more uniformly wet as the floating mister moves around.  Or is this a pump with sprayers?  Thanks.
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Posted Reply with quote  #75 
This is the nebulizer type and it's not floating.  This tank is too dang heavy as it is with just 2" of water in it for me to dump once a week to change water.  I don't think floating would make much difference on coverage as I'm pretty sure it would still stay in the same spot most of the time.  I'm considering a larger unit with the nebulizer and fan in a separate tank and blowing fog in via ducts so that I could dump that separate tank without even touching plants.  In that case the tank would probably be narrow and deep and I'd use the float that came with the nebulizer.
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RIMike

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Posted Reply with quote  #76 
For all those following along, here's a weekly update. First off, it's snowing, again. This sucks just like it did last weekend, the weekend before that, and so on. I'm debating adding bleach to my coffee and just end the suffering!

Now, back to the clones. A few things have leafed out, White Triana, and the variegated dog wood cuttings I took just to see what would happen.
IMG_0723.JPG 

Lots of stuff getting ready to send out some roots. Everything seems to be progressing except for the blueberry cuttings I have in there. They seem to just be sitting there.
  IMG_0724.JPG 
IMG_0725.JPG 

IMG_0726.JPG 

IMG_0727.JPG 

Heres the bottom of one of the variegated dogwoods. A small root is starting to show itself. Japanese Lilac in the back corner is about ready to root as well.
IMG_0731.JPG     
Everything is progressing along, and I'd expect to start seeing some real roots like Harvey showed in the next week.

IMG_0734.JPG 

Under the light, and pretty much the only things green and growing anywhere in New England right now!

Back Left - CDN
Back Right - Petit Negri
Middle Left- VDB Orphan
Middle Center - Dauphine
Middle Right - CDG
Front Left - VDB Orphan
Front Right - Bryant Dark
Far Right - Cityline Rio Hydrangea
 IMG_0737.JPG 

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schaplin

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Posted Reply with quote  #77 
Ok How does a fig go from having no roots to having one about an 1" long overnight?
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Posted Reply with quote  #78 
...how do you say "I think I can, I think I can, I think I can..." in Figese?
Jim
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Posted Reply with quote  #79 
Here's an update on cuttings in my fog cloner.  Cuttings have been put in there at various times with the ones with the largest roots started 4 weeks ago on 1/24.  Maybe time for potting up the largest one?

[IMAG2835] 

[IMAG2834] 
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Posted Reply with quote  #80 
Harvey,
  Are you hoping to get the roots out totally undamaged?
I think Sharon and Gloria were saying they left theirs in longer and the roots hardened off and became more pliable than typical roots on cuttings...

  I've got my bins and mister, and my netcups and collars are in the mail, so I'm almost ready to pull the trigger on this, too.  (But I keep reading good things about rooting in coco coir, so I'm second guessing myself...)
Jim
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Posted Reply with quote  #81 
Jim, being the investigative kind of guy I am, I've already pulled these cuttings up before just to see how they would work out.  No damage at all with the biggest problem being getting them back in.  I'll probably wait, but am anxious to get the potted up.
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Posted Reply with quote  #82 
Nice!
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Posted Reply with quote  #83 
Thanks for starting this thread Sharon, I've really enjoyed everyones pictures and progress. 
Harvey, Looks really nice, glad your rat didn't get to those babies
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Posted Reply with quote  #84 
Coop, I ended up moving all of my figs out into the greenhouse until the rat issue got "resolved" except for these in the cloner.  I have a tub covering them but I still kept watching just to see if the rat might be gnawing a hole to get to them! :)
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Gofigure

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Posted Reply with quote  #85 
Amazing roots Harvey. What kind of fogger do you have (size, number of discs)? I tested a single disc for an hour but the output was very low.

I ordered a set of rotating nozzles that are adjustable from 1 to 25 gph and an adjustable 50 gph pump to try. About $20 shipped. 
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Posted Reply with quote  #86 
Been using the cloner since the fall.  Love it.

Here's 6 weeks of root development from last batch:

IMG_4331.JPG 

And this is the new batch:

IMG_4543.JPG 

I'm set up with misters.  How does the fogger work?  Can someone post more pics of it?

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Posted Reply with quote  #87 
Hi Danny
Very nice roots and a very nice rig. Did you make that yourself? If so, you should be very proud of your nice work. Any discoveries when building it?

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Posted Reply with quote  #88 
Thanks, Coop.

It was pretty straightforward.  Followed what Dennis did and whatever tutorials were on YouTube.
Didn't want to change anything so nothing new to report.

I was thinking about building a second one but I like the fogger idea.
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Posted Reply with quote  #89 
Dennis gave me the green light to pot up that cutting with the most advanced roots.  Think I'll wait until daylight. :)
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Posted Reply with quote  #90 
How's the top growth on the one's you're going to pot up?
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Posted Reply with quote  #91 
I potted up one recently that had roots over a foot long, it had no shock at all in is growing like a weed. I have only lost one to shock so far and that one I just should have waited but I got impatient.

IMG_0988.JPG  This first one is the ones that are no longer in the humility bin
2.23.15HB.jpg 
2.23.15.jpg  These are some I have just started and few that you can see have been in a long time, I am running out of room outside of the bubbler so I am working on making room before I pot some of these up, but it seems they are not hurt by staying in longer.
Bnr4H.jpg  This is the first cloner I got, the other I made. So far I am very happy with the results I have had.

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Posted Reply with quote  #92 
Here is my first cloner plant being potted up, 30 days after being started (others haven't done as well, this one is the best).

[IMAG2843] 

This one was started at the same time,  Slower to develop roots and wants to produce figs instead of leaves! I removed the fruit immediately after taking photo.

[IMAG2844] 
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Posted Reply with quote  #93 
Now Harvey, be honest....how hard was it to process those cuttings? And where there any gnats? I'm glad I stepped out and tried the cloner and shared my results.

And yes, if you want, you can leave your cuttings in the cloner longer. I left some of mine in for 30 days and there was so much top growth that I could not keep the cutting vertical. The choice is yours.
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Posted Reply with quote  #94 
Dennis, I don't usually have much in the way of problems with fungus gnats using ProMix HP to begin with.  For me, the things I like about the cloner are:
1. Don't need to water ever 2-3 days, worrying about getting moisture level exactly right.
2. I can know exactly how roots are doing.
3. I use a tub for humidity and that protected them from that dang rat!!! :)
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Harvey - Correia Farms
Isleton, CA (Sacramento County) USDA zone 9b, Sunset zone 14

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coop951

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Posted Reply with quote  #95 
Great work Gloria and Harvey, Dennis, Rafael and Mike
Love seeing the beautiful roots developed by these machines. 
I'm convinced, next year....
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nycfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #96 
Harvey - I'm thinking about building a second cloner.  What type of fogger did you get?  After you installed the fan did you notice fog leaking out from anywhere?  Any nutrients?
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Danny NYC Z7a

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Posted Reply with quote  #97 
Forget next year...  Do it now Coop  :)
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Posted Reply with quote  #98 
Hi all,

Sorry to take so long to update.  Lots of things going on with the new house.  Mine cuttings are starting to root despite the cooler temperature.  A Nigara Black that was a gift from Marius has started rooting.  The one in front was from Driveway farm and is a
Scott's Black.  As you can see the roots are long and the tips are in the water.  I should have turned off the mister but I am too lazy to take another photo.  Many thanks to Dennis for his first post on using cloners.  figs in the mist.jpg 

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schaplin

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Posted Reply with quote  #99 
One other thing.  I like this method because I don't have to keep digging up my figs every day to see if I have roots yet.  My plants are not as far along but I think that is because I am growing much colder (~60 F)
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HarveyC

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Posted Reply with quote  #100 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nycfig
Harvey - I'm thinking about building a second cloner.  What type of fogger did you get?  After you installed the fan did you notice fog leaking out from anywhere?  Any nutrients?


Danny, I got the fogger that Sharon had posted a link to earlier but it can be found cheaper on eBay.  I bought the fan and AC adapter on eBay and Amazon and some fog does definitely escape and I need to add water some of the time but not really a big deal.  In fact, Gloria had told me to change water about every week and add new hydrogen peroxide and Clonex nutrient solution (1 teaspoon each) but I've skipped dumping out any old water and just add the new stuff and that seems okay.

If I build a larger cloner I would make the lid tighter-fitting and have the water reservoir separate and run it to the cloning unit by a 2" hose with a return hose and that would make it easier to dump out water.  I'm thinking of buying a storage tub that is made for going under a bed (i.e., 24" x 40" or so) and building a plywood box to go under it and coating that with fiberglass resin.  Still not there as far as making a decision yet.
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Harvey - Correia Farms
Isleton, CA (Sacramento County) USDA zone 9b, Sunset zone 14

http://www.figaholics.com
https://www.facebook.com/Figaholics
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