Well...I transferred my little first year tree from it's one gallon pot into a much larger 8-10 gallon pot about ten days ago.   I used a commercial compost (gro-mulch) and just filled in around the old rootball with it.

I watered it in real good...then did it again two days later.   The tree looked great untill a couple of days ago when it's leaves started to wilt just a little.   Yesterday was a little worse, and today I realized I better do something or I will loose the tree.

So I dumped the mulch....and as you might imagine it was still soggy  and boggy 7 days after the last good watering...which is why the tree is failing I would guess...and replaced it with a 90% loose light sandy soil and 10% of the mulch.  

The mix is damp as it rained last night.   I really wanted to water it in, but decided not to.  It is now three hours after the repot and the leaves do appear to be coming back a little.    They wern't fully drooped...just looking like they were hurtin.  It is in a  shaded area on the north side of my covered front porch and will stay there for a few days while it recovers.

Any suggestions on what else to do with it?  Should I give it a shot of miricale grow?  Do you think it will pull through?  This repot is temporary...it goes into the ground next spring.

Are there drainage holes in the new pot?  Are they plugged up and not draining?

It has drainage holes in the bottom.  It's a big pot.  Maybe I should drill a few holes in the side?  

You don't mention temperature.

I would stop watering, put it in the shade to stop stressing the plant, and figure out how to judge the moisture level in the soil.

In the future, up-pot from 1g to 2g, then to 5g, and then to a larger size.  A 1g plant does not need or benefit from 8-10 gallons of soil, potting mix, or whatever. It is still a 1g plant and needs to be treated as such.

i don't know if this might help, but: http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?Some-tips-on-uppotting-5390290

I get a feel for the weight of the pots by using one hand and tilting it back.
Takes a little practice but you eventually get a feel for the different size containers and when they need watering.

Udaman...there are three small drainage holes in the bottom of the pot.   I am thinking I may drill some holes around the sides to insure proper drainage in such a large pot.

Thanks for the link Jason.  Lots of good info.  I appreciate you writing it in the first place, and directing me to it in the second place.  I'm gonna print it out to save.

Martin...this is my first up pot to this big a pot, and it is a different soil medium, so it will take some time to get a feel for the weight of the pot (dry vrs wet).

Pitangadiego...temps have been in the 80's to 90's, cooling into the upper 60's at night.   I put the tree in a semi shaded spot for a week, then moved it to where it was getting  more sun.  I watered it twice, then left it alone for a week.  Tree looked great for that first week, then began to wilt about the time I figured it would be over any replanting shock and should be getting established.

Bottom line I think...is too much sun too soon...but also the medium I used for the first repot.   10 days after the first repot, and 8 days after the last watering, the medium was still soggy at the bottom of the pot, and still wet an inch below the surface.

So...it is now in a much looser, lighter soil, with just a little of the compost product mixed in.
The tree looks much better this morning after the second repot with the new soil.

Good drainage isn't a function of how many holes there are in a container or where they are located. One hole at the lowest part of the container is as effective as 100. I probably should qualify that by saying 100 holes might speed up water loss via evaporation because more soil would be exposed to the air, but 'more holes' won't improve drainage.

Good drainage is inextricably tied to the size and gradient distribution of particles that comprise the soil. That's a technical way of saying the smaller the soil particles are, the more water-retentive the soil will be. Perched water kills. That is to say the layer of soggy soil at the bottom of containers that is saturated to the degree all air is forced out kills roots within hours. Not until air returns to that part of the soil can roots recolonize that part of the soil, or can the plant regenerate lost roots. This cyclic death & regeneration of lost roots is very expensive from the perspective of energy management. The plant recognizes the compromised root system as a powerful energy sink. Chemical messengers tell the tree to focus nearly all energy allocation to replacing lost roots. This energy WOULD have gone toward extending branches, growing more foliage, to fruiting, or just an increase in woody mass if the timing is appropriate.

Plants are able to realize their best potential in soils that hold no, or very little perched water (that soggy thing). Our plants don't sip or drink water; they absorb it molecule by molecule from the thin coating of water on colloidal surfaces and from water vapor in soil pores.

It's VERY difficult to start with fine particles (peat/compost/sand/topsoil) and amend. Until large particles make up more than about 70% of the soil, the soil will retain drainage and flow-through characteristics of the fine particles, though not necessarily the same water retention. If you imagine a quart of pudding and ask yourself how much perlite you'd need to add to get it to drain properly, you'll be well on the way to being able to visualize what I just said.

If you intend to leave the plants in the heavy soil they're in now, you might consider partially burying them. This turns the earth into a giant wick that will help the excess water exit the pot, and technically turns your container into a small raised bed (hydrologically speaking).

Al   

Looks like it's gonna make it.  I drilled more holes around the bottom of the pot and the tree continued to wilt untill two days ago when I finally decided I better water it.  I was kind of afraid to do that....since the waterlogged issue is what almost killed in the first place.   Did that...with a little miricale grow and it has bounced back.   The remaining leaves (it lost half of them) have that perky healthy look again.  My guess is it's still pretty weak though.  I think this guy is gonna be an indoor house plant till next April or so...then it goes into the ground.

Thanks for weighing in also Al....and to the rest of you who responded.

Dave,
A trick you can do to help monitor level of moisture from top to bottom of pot is invest in a bag of long wooden skewers or thin dowel rods.  You can leave it parked in the pot all the way to the bottom, remove it and look at the moisture on the stick.  Or, spend $10 on a moisture meter at local big-box store. ($5 on eBay...gotta love it!).   That is, UNTIL you get used to the difference in picking up your pots, but eventually your pots will be too big to pick up all by yourself.
   Also, if you feel your potted plant is too wet, you can create a wick by getting a string mop or similar material and tucking one end up the hole(s) of the pot...it will wick the moisture out pretty quickly. 

Dave - I think your tree would be much happier if you follow Mother Nature's lead and give it a long cold rest over the winter (as in dormant/quiescent), until danger of frost has past.

Also, it's not widely understood that moisture meters are very ineffective as a tool for determining moisture levels. What they ACTUALLY measure is the electrical conductivity of the soil solution, which is determined by the concentration of dissolved solids in the solution. IOW, they're much better at determining the salt or fertility level of the soil than the moisture content. To illustrate: if you insert the probe into a cup of deionized (distilled) water, it will read "DRY". Add a little salt or sugar to the water and it will read "WET".

Al 

Totally concur with Al on the moisture meters. IMO, they are useless. Test one the way Al's explained and you'll see that the readings on them are inaccurate.

Also, if one wants to use a wick system (through the drainage holes), make sure the pot is elevated above the ground so whatever that wicks the water away does not touch the ground. But again, I really don't see its benefit if you have a well draining mix.


Navid.

Moisture meters are hole pokers. Tried and kept getting different measurements.

An engineer-plant addict friend says if your "all metal" moisture meter reads dry when you put it in a glass of water, just take a fine piece of sand paper or a cheap emery board and lightly buff the metal spike electrode.  Should fix that.  

Sara types
That is, UNTIL you get used to the difference in picking up your pots, but eventually your pots will be too big to pick up all by yourself.

Hi SARA , no i mention this in post above. 
I get a feel for the weight of the pots by using one hand and tilting it back.

I would look like the Hulk i i lifted my pots or i would be in hospital.
One does not lift the pot unless its 3 gallon or smaller.
One gets used to the weight no matter what mix is used simply by tilting pot.
In my big pots 30g , well the trees are large enough i just grab the tree trunk and pull towards me which tilts the pot.
Its very simply process and easy to get use to , been doing it for years.  ; )



 

Sara - the issue I described is an inherent issue with all inexpensive 'moisture meters' because they measure electrical conductivity, not moisture levels. The meter that reads 'DRY' when inserted in deionized water (because w/o ions the distilled water doesn't conduct electricity) will read 'WET' when inserted into a cup of tap water next to the deionized water. This is because the tap water contains dissolved solids that conduct the electricity the meter measures.

Your finger or a wooden skewer used as described upthread is a much more accurate way of assessing soil moisture levels.

Al

 With my larger trees in one to five gallon pots watering isn't as critical and I do it once or twice a week except during drought conditions and extreme heat and then I do it almost daily. Some times I use the finger probe method and also keep an eye on the leaves. They will really tell you when they want water and I don't mean when they are all dried up. Just the position they hold themselves on the tree will tell if you pay attention.

Now when it come to started cuttings in cups or young trees in small pots of 3 to 6 inches, watering can be very critical as we know. Just a little too much and wham it's gone, better to be on the dry side.

I cannot argue Al's point about what the meters read but I do know this. I don't use distilled water and doubt that anyone else does. I also know if I take an empty glass and put the meter in, it will read dry. If i put a few ounces of tap water in that glass it will read all the way up the scale to wet. Like wise, if I stick it in dry soil it reads dry, but if I pour a little water in that cup with the probe all the way to the bottom, as the water works its way down the meter will start rising. With that said, light fluffy soils will not give you as good a reading as heavy soils because there is less contact with the probe. What I have done to try to understand the readings I get is to take my starting mix and slowly mix in a little water with my hand until I get it to that just right feeling of slightly damp which I find is the best for newly started cuttings. I then use the meter to read this mix. With my mix I find that a reading of around 3, which is the border line between dry and moist, is the most favorable. When it gets to a 2 reading I add a little water, perhaps as little a 1 ounce. That usually brings it back to a reading of 3 or 4. Any more and I run into issues.

This works well for me and like any tool its best to know how to use it. I've yet to lose a young plant because of watering issues while doing as stated above.

Al I not trying to argue your point, just stating what works for me. By the way welcome to the forum.
"gene"

I stand corrected Martin, I was "talking" about my situation which is beginner and small pots that can be picked up.  You are correct, the bigger pots typically cannot be picked up unless you are the Hulk or Superman.  Regardless, with the debate on moisture meter vs dowel rod vs feel the pot, we all will find our way & the input that everyone here provides will help us each experiment and find what works best for us.  As a beginner "in all things plants" the meter helped me find my way. 

While I am also somewhat of a beginer (when compared to most of you here at least), and I have huge respect for Al's knowledge and experience, I do have one area of disagreement with his earlier advice as well.
On the issue of dormancy.  My trees at Lake Havasu in Arizona, where temps rarely (and some years never) fall below 40 degrees in winter, retained a substantial amount of theri leaves through winter.   They would drop them one or two at a time in the Spring, but after putting on new leaves and growth.

My thinking on bringing the repotted mission tree indoors was to extend it's growing season so as to allow it to more fully recover from it's near death experience when I allowed the roots to remain waterlogged.   dMy thoughts are that...if it goes into dormancy now...it won't develop newer and stronger roots to support it's massive 18" height when it begins to leaf out again in the spring.

The dormancy debate is an interesting one.  I believe we had that one a couple of years ago.   It's a little like the chicken and the egg.  Do our trees go dormant to "rest" and recoup strength for the upcoming growing season as Al suggests, (correct me if I've mistated your position Al), or is dormancy purely a reaction to colder condiditons and a reduction of light due to shorter days and longer nights?

My little tree is happy and strong looking again (less half of it's leaves, but they have that "look" Martin referred to in his post above).  I just think that allowing it to continue to grow through the winter can only strengthen it and better prepare it for an outdoor planting in April.

Oh, I don't mind being disagreed with, and it's not like it's never happened before. ;-) It's never a big thing when the disagreeing parties have a mutual respect for each other. What I said may not apply to you because of where you live. For some reason, I was under the impression you lived in a cooler clime. When I see zone 7, I'm thinking 0-10* as winter lows.

Dormancy serves two functions. Most importantly, it allows perennial plants to withstand temperatures that would be lethal to the organism if not for the protection of the dormancy mechanism; so in that regard it is related to survival. In this case, we're probably only mildly interested in that aspect. Dormancy and quiescence also allow trees to suspend above ground growth, as well as energy expenditures other than the minimal outlay required to keep the plant's systems orderly. Roots continue to grow at temperatures as low as a few degrees above freezing.

You guys know your own trees best, so I'll always defer to your judgment re your own trees; but generally speaking, indoors is an inhospitable environ for temperate trees. It's not uncommon for trees grown indoors to die or enter spring severely enfeebled by the steady drain on their energy reserves over the long winter. Damaged foliage or foliage lost due to unfavorable indoor conditions and subsequently replaced through activation of dormant buds represent significant energy outlays, as does any lost rootage due to any problems that might arise in the rhizosphere. Reduced ability to carry on photosynthesis due to reduced photo-period and photo-intensity make it all but impossible to replenish energy reserves. A window with insulating glass reduces photo intensity under even the best of circumstances by a minimum of 35% (with no pyrolytic coatings, heat mirror, tinting ....), so a plant in a room with all glass walls and a glass roof would still receive light at less than 60% of the intensity it would when it was outdoors. Factor greatly reduced photo-period into that due to shorter days and the basis for my premise becomes clearer.

On the other hand, a tree that is allowed a cold rest until danger of frost has passed (or as close as possible to that pivotal point) wakes i spring with ALL its reserve energy, save that tiny amount expended on keeping systems orderly. Actually, the tree doesn't recoup energy as much as it preserves it for the spring push. The result is a much stronger spring flush of growth - more energy to extend & push foliage to maturity faster. Leaves begin offering a net return on energy expenditures at about the point where the leaf is about 75% mature, so the tree has a vested interest in putting on as many leaves as possible & growing them to maturity as quickly as possible.

Another tree that may or may not require a dormant period is (Ulmus parvifolia (Chinese elm). They can be over-wintered indoors, and I have traveled that route in the past. They make it until spring in pretty good shape, but repotting them (even though a very genetically vigorous species) is often very iffy because they are so weakened by the indoor stay. They recover slowly over the summer & it's only by late summer or fall that they regain the vitality they might have been growing with all along.

In the end, trees grown in colder areas will be larger and healthier in the subsequent autumn if they have a cold rest, than if brought into unfavorable indoor conditions to over-winter. With plants, there is no such thing as regaining lost potential. Lost potential is gone permanently, so anything that reduces growth or vitality, forever affects the tree. Trees can never 'catch up'.

Does this offering apply to you - maybe not, but it would to other zone 7ers that see more typical zone 7 temps, unless perhaps they were growing under some quality lighting, like HPS or halides and at least somewhat favorable humidity.

Take care, and thanks for the opportunity to explain.

I think my earlier post was unclear.   We moved from Havasu (listed as zone 7b....actually closer to  zone 9), to our current location in the Verde Valley three months ago, then moved to our new house (also iin the Verde Valley, zone 7) last month.  The tree has been potted but will become an outdoor tree in the spring.

I related the Havasu experience merely to point out that my fig trees there did not experience full dormancy, yet grew prolifically and produced well.

You have certainly given me something to think about here Al.  I may yet decide to overwinter it in the garage.

Thanks.

Best luck & much success, Dave.

Al