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Encanto Farms Nursery > Topics > 2014 ,New fig embryos,here in NJ
 
 


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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #1 
I have new embryos fruits like a rice seed on:
Malta Black
Adriatic JH
Tacoma Violet
Malta blk and Adriatic JF were winter protected while Tacoma V,was not.
Malta black was protected better,and came out from Winter with a foot high stems,the others grew from soil line.
All had 6 inches of mulch,or more, at root area.
All my figs are in ground.
MGorski

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Posted Reply with quote  #2 
Glad you are seeing figlets on your inground trees Herman. Its good to learn what varieties will produce after being killed to the ground. I used a thick layer of hay this winter, it got down to 2 F, the uncovered soil was frozen, but underneath the straw it was unfrozen. I might have used as much as a foot of mulch.

Mike in Hanover, VA
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Quackmaster

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Posted Reply with quote  #3 
Hello Vasile, how did your in ground trees fair this past winter, I'm waiting to see some of your great listing on ebay this season.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #4 
Ryan:All figs that were not Winter protected died to soil line.
All are coming back,from underground roots.
Some come out early some come out later,depending on genes.
Some will make ripe fruits this year many will not.
Even some Winter protected fig trees died to soil line.
I only put out on this site,what,is ahead.
jdsfrance

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Posted Reply with quote  #5 
Hi Herman2,
Here, even BT is not able to ripe fruit when coming back from soil level.
For a comparison, do you have a BT ? That comes back from dirt ? How is she doing ?
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Quackmaster

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Posted Reply with quote  #6 
Well I hope they grow back healthier then ever, the ones I got from you last year are doing great,  the nero 600m for one is growing like a weed putting on a few figs that I'm looking forward too.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #7 
I had brown turkey,but will not properly ripe here,because of lack of long hot dry Summer.
robertharper

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Posted Reply with quote  #8 
Herman, will your Tacoma Violet have time to ripen it's fruit, this year?

If so, how many fruit do you think it will ripen, before first frost.

If I remember right, Tacoma Violet was found by Gene Hosey, right?

Bob Harper
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #9 
yes Tacoma V will ripe if I leave only three trunks,and it will make about 3 dozen ripe fruits, only this year just because it died to soil line.
But of course this Winter was ,colder than any other,in the last 30 years.
Next year it will be back in business with normal crop.
Once the tree start growing embryos now,it will ripe for sure till end of Summer.
Of course other work is involved,to produce ripe fruits,like pinching,removing extra growing buds,removing,late forming fruits.
All three figs mentioned above are early ripening,and willing to be manipulated ,to ripe fruits here ,in NJ.
Rewton

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Posted Reply with quote  #10 
Herman, in order to get the figs like Takoma Violet and Adriatic JH (which grew up from the soil line) to form fig embryos did you pinch them?  I have Kathleen's Black growing up two new trunks from the soil line that are now about 18 inches high.  There are no fig embryos evident but there are tiny branches forming a several nodes.  I have been reluctant to pinch them yet but maybe I should go ahead.  I'm sure the trunks will really branch out if I do.

Robert, Takoma Violet was discovered in Takoma Park, MD by Gene Hosey.
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coop951

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Posted Reply with quote  #11 
Hello Vasile
So happy to hear all is going well. My ingrounds also died back to ground but are pushing nice new growth. I am taking your advice this year and thinning out to just a few stalks and pinching. I can see the difference already on some, this pinching is new to me and I am now pinch crazy.
The MBVS, Malta Black and Adriatic JH cuttings I received from you are doing great. Very nice and strong young plants.
Thank you my friend
Coop
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #12 
Of course I pinched them,they pause growt for 2 weeks form fruits and a new top bud grow after that.
Also grow buds appear down the trunk,which I remove too.
By the way:only the branches I pinched grew fruit buds now the rest did not.
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #13 
Today noticed embryos fruits on,my in ground :
Battaglia,and
St. Anthony
Yes it is, about 2 weeks later than last year,but if the Fall is sunny and long,the named cultivars will ripe!
RichinNJ

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Posted Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herman2
Today noticed embryos fruits on,my in ground :
Battaglia,and
St. Anthony
Yes it is, about 2 weeks later than last year,but if the Fall is sunny and long,the named cultivars will ripe!


Interesting. Battaglia as an in ground in NJ. 
rafaelissimmo

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Posted Reply with quote  #15 
Herman my Malta Black in partial sun here in NYC has strong growth and maybe 20 fig embryos, thank you for the advice to plant it. I did not pinch it. I did pinch RdB which is next to Malta Black but I don't see any embryos yet. Maybe plant is too small or too young.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #16 
Malta black produce fruit Embryo early and need only 70 days till ripe.
Ronde de Bordeaux ,Improved Celeste,St Anthony,also ,will ripe in 70 days.
Yet Ronde de B,do not have Embryos here yet,possible because it started from about 2 inches from soil line.
To explain about Battaglia Green:Yes it has Embryos early,but it takes 90 days to ripe.
Other late ripening figs like Madeira Black,takes 100 days to ripe,in my climate.
RichinNJ

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Posted Reply with quote  #17 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herman2
Malta black produce fruit Embryo early and need only 70 days till ripe.
Ronde de Bordeaux ,Improved Celeste,St Anthony,also ,will ripe in 70 days.
Yet Ronde de B,do not have Embryos here yet,possible because it started from about 2 inches from soil line.
To explain about Battaglia Green:Yes it has Embryos early,but it takes 90 days to ripe.
Other late ripening figs like Madeira Black,takes 100 days to ripe,in my climate.


Fig math ... Very nice
Tam

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Posted Reply with quote  #18 
Herman: Thanks for sharing good information.

Best,
Tam
MGorski

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Posted Reply with quote  #19 
This is the first i have heard of days to ripening for figs, that is useful information. Thanks for sharing your observations Herman, hope to hear more of that.

Mike in Hanover, VA
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MichaelTucson

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Posted Reply with quote  #20 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MGorski
This is the first i have heard of days to ripening for figs, that is useful information. Thanks for sharing your observations Herman, hope to hear more of that. Mike in Hanover, VA


Here's some related informationthat Vasile posted a couple of years ago about ripening times/stages.
http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/fig-tree-fruit-growing-stages-5912299

Mike   central NY state, zone 5a
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MGorski

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Posted Reply with quote  #21 
Thanks for the link Mike!

Mike in Hanover, VA
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can_smokva

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Posted Reply with quote  #22 
Vasile,
From your observations over past decade or so, would you be able to post a comprehensive table with ripening time (number of days from observing embrio to fully ripe) for your zone?
suggested form will be as below:

minimum days to ripen                             fig variety
70                                                                negrone, HC, etc
80                                                                  xxxx
90                                                                  yyyyy
100                                                                zzzzz
120                                                              aaaaaaaa

Just cover those you grow or you are familiar with.

Thanks

Damir
Chivas

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Posted Reply with quote  #23 
Black Madeira for me is anywhere from 100-110 days depending on weather,glad it's not just me.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #24 
Here is how long it takes to ripe:
70 days:Malta black, Improved Celeste,Ronde de Bordeaux,St Anthony.
75 days:Mt etna type figs ,Hardy Chicago etc.
80 days:Kathleen black,Atreano,Dalmatie,Tacoma Violet,Violette de Bordeaux,Nero 600m,etc
85 days:Adriatic JH,Longue D'Out,Sal Corleone,other Sicilian type figs.
90 days:Battaglia,Vasilika Syka,Verte,Col de dame, etc.
100 days or more:Madeira black,Ital 258,Preto,Verdal longue,etc

Note:Fig do not form Embryos at the same time,some form early(May 15) some form late,up till July 1.
The duration of growth from inception till ripe count,and the date of embryos forming is important in order to call a cultivar,early ,or late ripening.
This data refer to main crop fruits only and naturally grown in ground fig trees.
Growing in pot,the results will vary,usually,they ripe faster,if,pots are,placed in full sun ,on black top early,to,get them going,and brought indoors for the night,to avoid frost early in Spring.
Also keeping pots in greenhouse early in Spring will send them into growing much earlier,and so early ripe fruits can be had.
Also Full sun is the most important,in zone 6b,or colder and it will make the difference between getting ripe fruits or not.
MichaelTucson

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Posted Reply with quote  #25 
Herman, do you find that the presence of brebas has an effect on when the embryos form?  Someone in another thread was suggesting that it might.  But in my experience I haven't seen that.  Do you?

Mike

<edit> In other words, what I'm asking is this:  Say you're looking at two trees of Hardy Chicago, and they're clones of each other (same genes, and kept in same culture side by side).  On one of them you knock off any brebas that form, and on the other tree you leave the brebas on.  Will the main crop embryos form at the same time on both trees?  Or will the embryos on the one that has brebas be delayed and form later?  (Like I said, I haven't seen that, but someone was suggesting something along those lines, so I'm interested to hear what your experience would suggest).
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MichaelTucson

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Posted Reply with quote  #26 
Also, a different comment about the times you've posted.  Interesting that you see 70 days for Ronde de Bordeaux.  Here in central NY, I was seeing RDB taking longer than 70 days.  Maybe because my RDB tree formed the embryos pretty late, so by the time it got into the later ripening stage, the temperatures were getting pretty cool.  But in your chart you show 70 days for Ronde de Bordeaux, and I was seeing more like 80 - 85 days last year.  Probably because it was so cool by the time they were finishing off the ripening.

Mike   central NY state, zone 5a 
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #27 
Breba, if numerous will delay main crop forming and ripening.
It can be seen better with English Brown Turkey,when breba are left.
English BT will only ripe a couple of main crop ,if Breba is left on,in colder climates.
Of course leaving only a couple of Breba will not retard main crop,on a older tree.
MichaelTucson

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Posted Reply with quote  #28 
Thanks for posting that Herman.  As far as English Brown Turkey, in my climate I go for breba anyway for that variety.  A good year is when there are lots of breba on them.  Because the growing season is short enough, and the main crop form late enough in the year, it's rare here to ever get main crop EBT to ripen.  (I only saw it happen one year since 1966... for most years with EBT here, breba is the only crop you'll get).  Luckily for me, I like the taste of the EBT breba that grow here.  I prefer them to the main crop.  (Better taste).

By the way, do you consider English Brown Turkey a Mt. Etna type?

Mike   central NY state, zone 5a
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #29 
I had the large English BT,with copper like exterior,and that isnot a Mt Etna type.
Beautiful color fruits when it get ripe in some years only.
Here is a pix

Attached Images
jpeg English_Brown_TurkeyDSCN031018.JPG (124.93 KB, 55 views)
robertharper

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Posted Reply with quote  #30 
Herman, were would you place on the list Florea?

Also, are there any figs that could be earlier like 65 and or 60 days?

Bob Harper
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #31 
Bob,I forgot about Florea.
Florea ,is very early,in a group with Improved Celeste if not earlier.
timclymer

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Posted Reply with quote  #32 
Herman,

Excellent information as always. I've had trouble with getting some of my in-ground figs to set figs this year, even with pinching and avoiding fertilizing. They're all growing quickly and look healthy but when I pinch they seem to only push out more growth and not little figlets. Any suggestions? The ones in pots in new soil don't seem to have this problem, even though they're also growing quickly.

I'd agree that Florea is earlier than the rest, maybe at 65 days (according to your chart). Last year I was almost able to get two main crops off of it, the first on the first growth flush and then a later crop from a subsequent growth flush.

Tim
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #33 
Tim:The reason why some cultivars do not form embryos early,and ,keep growing only,is that ,the days average temp. are too low for !!!!!!Bolting!!!!,---Flowering,----,when it comes to late ripening cultivars.
All we can do is remove those new growth,but only after growing about 2 inches and then remove only the new tips,because fruits will grow at the first node on the new growth.
This is needed so the  canopy does not become too dense.
Meanwhile certain cultivars (early ripening),will form embryos the sooner they start growing new wood,because they will bolt out ,Flower ,at lower average temperature.
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #34 
Today,I have new embryos on :
Ronde De Bordeaux
Improved Celeste(O'Rourke not)
They started at about 2 inches from soil line this Spring,being killed by Frost.
Chivas

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Posted Reply with quote  #35 
I am still waiting for embryos on rdb that was in a pot (now in ground), it may have some embryos but they are too small for me to say that they are for sure or not.  Black Madeira started a couple weeks ago as did col de dama blanc.  
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #36 
You must have Madeira black and Col de dame in pot,to have Embryos at this time,because my inground do not have Embryos yet.
Again:It was a cool Spring and also cool June here so,the late cultivars did not have the proper warm days to ,flower here,(grow embryos).
After all,fig fruits are all flowers.
Chivas

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Posted Reply with quote  #37 
You are correct, both are in pots and both suffered little winter damage and growing well although the Balck Madeira is showing more fmv than it usually does, I will have to prune these branches off and only leave the healthiest ones, not a big deal anyways since I have to root prune next year.  It is strange though as all new growth on it is pushing out a lot of figs, more than it normally has done in the past.
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MichaelTucson

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Posted Reply with quote  #38 
RDB has embryos here.  (Lots of varieties here are making fairly heavy main crop figs).  Aubique Petite has main crop.  Petite Negra has both breba and numerous small main crop fruit.  HC is loaded this year.  Way too soon to tell how all these figs will ripen, but seems a very heavy year for breba and lots of types have main crop.  Peter's Honey has a lot of breba (first year I've seen breba on this tree), plus a lot of main crop forming too, with many of them doubled.  I'll try to post some pictures in the next couple of days.

Mike   central NY state, zone 5a
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Posted Reply with quote  #39 
Excellent thread Herman. My trees with main crop embryos are :

In-Ground trees = Osborne Prolific, Latarrula, Enrico, Nardi Blk, Nebo, Melanzana, Vincenzo, Yugo Yellow, RdB,
Longue d'Aout, Barbillone, Lebanese Red, Hollier, Stella, Gino, Vern's BT, Large Dark Greek, Conadria, Elana, Verte,
Salam Dark

In Pots Outdoor= Florea, Ginoso, MVSB, Aldo, Gieshbul, Cdd Grise, Atreano RR, Flanders, Genoa, Champagne, HC,
Dark Portuguese, Paradiso Bronze, Flanders, Tena

In Green House = O'Rourke, Vasilika Sika, JH Adriatic, VdB, RdB, Morena, Nero600M, Genovese Nero, Atreano OR,
Rosetta(?), Norella

If we continue to have a warm trend, this could be my best year for brebas and main crop. The in-ground trees should like
last year give us plentiful figs. I am very please with O'Rourke last year. It was wintered outdoor in its large container last
season. I moved it into unfinished(re-build) green house late last month and if I am not wrong, every node has a fig. I pinched
its top. Almost all my trees are pinched mainly by 5th leaf except DK.







































































=
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #40 
July 1:
I noticed new Embryos on:
Violette de Bordeaux
Ischia Black
Sicilian Black
Dalmatie
All 4 started from soil level being killed by Winter cold.
All my trees are inground.
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Posted Reply with quote  #41 
Vasile, was your Kathleen's Black killed to soil level too?  Is it developing figs yet?  Mine (started from cutting July 2012 and put in ground Spring 2013) developed quite a number of figs last year but not in time for them to ripen.  This year it was killed to soil level, put out 2 new shoots from a node at the soil surface, and is now growing like crazy.  I pinched it about 3 weeks ago but all is wants to do is put out new branches rather than make figs!  Almost every node has a new branch coming out.  The other odd thing is that it never, until this Spring, showed any fmv symptoms but the two new shoots show some fmv signs even though it is growing like crazy.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #42 
Steve:The  mosaic virus look is because the plant was damaged by frost even below surface.
It is stress not FMV.
Mine was killed down to soil too,and growing fast now.
No incipient fruit buds yet.
RichinNJ

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Posted Reply with quote  #43 
Honestly ... Please stop with the "embryos " stuff .. .. Good grief ... Try figlets ..or something else ...burp yuk....
Chivas

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Posted Reply with quote  #44 
I found now a couple weeks ago what I thought were fig embryos on my rdb but only could confirm last week as they swelled out and took shape.  It looks like the Dalmatie is putting out some embryos and the Negrone for the first time in 3 years in finally putting some on too so I hope it just isn't a tease.  Panachee is as well, Colar also started last week.  Niagara black put them out a few weeks ago and the figs are starting to really swell from embryos to fingernail size quickly with the heat.  Those are in pot trees, not in ground other than the Dalmatie and Niagara black (the one in ground is only a week behind the 1 in pot and was killed almost to the ground, only a few inches survived, dalmatie also was killed to the ground).  
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #45 
Yes it was a harsh Winter.
The fig trees are late in forming fruits.
I have high hopes that the cultivars that formed fruits up to July 1 will get them ripe.
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