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Encanto Farms Nursery > Topics > Should I avoid planting in this soil?
 
 


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m5allen

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Posted Reply with quote  #1 
I am pretty bummed.  I was digging a few holes last night in my yard at my new house, getting ready to finally plant a few figs in the ground.  I dug each hole about 3 feet wide and about 18" deep.  After I dug the second hole, I went to go look at the first and it was starting to fill up with water.  

It has been really rainy here and my whole yard is saturated and soggy.  I am worried about the roots sitting in soggy soil if I plant in these holes.  This isn't exactly a low spot in my yard or anything like that.  I even tried digging in some higher areas in my yard near my house foundation and they were pooling water as well, although not quite as bad.  

Below is a pic of the hole today, it is kind of hard to see, but there is still a little bit of water in the bottom and it is pretty mushy.  

I really don't want to have to stick with container gardening for figs, the hot FL sun really makes it so difficult to grow in containers.  I just bought a house with an acre lot and was really looking forward to finally getting my figs in the ground.

IMG_1396.JPG 

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-Mike

Tampa, FL Zone 9b. Growing: Black Madeira, CDDG, Malta Black, VDB, Petite Negra, LSU Purple, Celeste, Battaglia, Alma and Grasa's Unknown Seattle Purple
figgary

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Posted Reply with quote  #2 
That's not good, Mike. I think if it were me, I'd plant in really large containers, with enough holes in the bottom to allow the roots to try and grow into that soil. It looks to not have enough air or drainage to plant directly.
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Gary in CA 9A  Seeking: Bebera Branca*, Colonel Littman's Cross
Gofigure

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Posted Reply with quote  #3 
I'd use raised beds at least a foot high. 

A few tips on problem areas: http://extension.missouri.edu/p/g6955
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ATL, GA, Zone 7b In ground varieties (22):Osborne Prolific, Conadria, Petit Negri, O'Rourke, Hardy Chicago, Texas BA-1, Alma, Celeste, Kadota, Green Ischia, Brown Turkey, Black Mission, Violette de Bordeaux, Texas Everbearing, Magnolia/Brunswick, LSU Purple, Dark Portuguese, Black Greek, Ronde de Bordeaux, Champagne, Dark Portuguese, Hybrid 0023. 
Rooting: Excel, 187-25, 291-4, 143-36, Cole de Dame, Calvert, Vernino, Santa Cruz Dark, Pastilliere, St. Jean, Barnisotte, Native de Argentile, VdB, Osborne Prolific.
Speedmaster

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Posted Reply with quote  #4 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofigure
I'd use raised beds at least a foot high. 

A few tips on problem areas: http://extension.missouri.edu/p/g6955



+ Nice Idea!
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andreas

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Posted Reply with quote  #5 
hi Mike congrats on the new house!!!
1)are you above or below 9 str. 
2)do you have to buy flood insurance?
3)are you sure its not salt water?
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andreas-patras
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m5allen

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Posted Reply with quote  #6 
Thanks everyone and thanks Andreas.

I thought about a raised bed, but don't mature fig tree roots run deep?  I am worried that even if I plant on a mound, that the roots will ultimately end up in the saturated zone.  I hate to say it, but maybe my only option is to get some of those 55 gal barrels cut in half and bury them in the ground.  I won't be as great as growing straight in the ground, but it will be a heck of a lot better than growing in a 7 gal black plastic nursery pot getting baked in the sun.  

At first, I wondered if it could be saltwater - I am close to the bay, but not that close.  There is a small spring-fed creek that runs though my neighborhood, but I am not on the creek.  I never had this problem in my previous house, but my new neighborhood is kind of country, there is no sewer drainage, everyone is on a septic tank.  So maybe that is why the water doesn't get channeled away very well.  I am in a flood zone X, which means I don't have to have flood insurance.  I am not sure what the elevation is at my house, but the house itself sits up noticeably higher than the surrounding land.  Some houses in my neighborhood are in a flood zone, but I think it is because they are on the creek.  
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-Mike

Tampa, FL Zone 9b. Growing: Black Madeira, CDDG, Malta Black, VDB, Petite Negra, LSU Purple, Celeste, Battaglia, Alma and Grasa's Unknown Seattle Purple
1king

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Posted Reply with quote  #7 
I have a couple old trees growing about 2' above sea level on heavy clay/ silt very near the ocean - I can smell when the tide is in! Here in bc we get enough rain to be classified as a temperate rainforest. I planted on a small mound and have fair to excellent production for over 10 years from the Desert king - but perhaps other varieties like lda would not like wet feet 8 months a year. A friend is on sandy soil at sea level and a few hundred feet from the beach and also has good production. I have read that ficus carica has a salt tolerance. I use un rinsed seaweed in potted plants with no apparent problems. You can do all kinds of things to direct water away from the trees...
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ivan - coastal bc
RichinNJ

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Posted Reply with quote  #8 
Put one in the ground right away and see how it does.
pino

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Posted Reply with quote  #9 
Don't know about Florida, but many areas have high water tables during the fall, winter and spring.  
Tile drainage can be used to solve water table issues.  Basically weeping tile 2' deep sloped to some area to drain to.
 
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strudeldog

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Posted Reply with quote  #10 
The fact that everyone is on septic indicates drainage in your general area is not bad and the ground passed perculation tests. Many areas will do this after extended rains.I would give a few a try, and ask your close neighbors and observe what they have planted and if they have issues related to high water table or poor drainage. I don't believe figs are any more sensitive than most plants to wet bottoms so unless your yard is a drainage area think looking at what your neighbors have planted  might lower your concerns.
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Phil N.GA. Zone 7 Looking for: De La Reina, Del La Senyora, Martinenca Rimada, Parfum De Cafards, Ponte Tresa,  Sangue Dulce, Emalyn's Purple, and on and on
andreas

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Posted Reply with quote  #11 
Mike barrels will not work.
water will come up.
you have to try one fig in ground for 2 years and hope it makes it.
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andreas-patras
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jdsfrance

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Posted Reply with quote  #12 
Hi m5allen,
I would fill that hole with compost from the nurseries ( better drainage ) and build a raised bed of 30 to 50 cm above dirt level, and plant the tree in that spot .
You could use a bottomless barrel to make the extra-height above the dirt.
That extra height will keep lots of roots safe and allow the tree to regrow new roots into the swampy area each year if needed.

Do you know how does that go in winter time ? Or Fall or Spring ? Does the water get any higher ?

Good luck !
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Charlie

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Posted Reply with quote  #13 
I have the same issue to deal with but worse.  Nearly killed my first fig tree that I buried to ground level.  Already lots of good advice, good luck.
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GeneDaniels

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Posted Reply with quote  #14 
I recommend you use your damp area in this way:

lay some old rotted wood in the large hole you dug, then cover with course sand
build a raised bed 12-18 inches, by 24 or 30 inches square on top of the hole

The fig roots will fill the upper area and stay dry, yet be able to reach down to the damp area and rotting wood when times are dry. I bet your figs will do just fine.

I am using the same plan for one spot I want to plant a VdB that has a high water table in the fall and spring.
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Zone 7b (Central Arkansas) Seven trees in the ground: Hardy Chicago, Celeste(?), LSU gold, Italian Black, Southern Brown Turkey(?), Strawberry Verte, and Unk yellow.  Trees in pots: VdB, CdD, and Sicilian?
Quackmaster

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Posted Reply with quote  #15 
I live below sea level and just a little rain and the water table is at the surface. Wait till it hasn't rained for a while and plant in ground. I couldn't imagine trying to raise figs in pots in the heat we have down here. Once the figs are established the water will not kill them unless they are in really low areas or you get hurricane or something. Here in south Louisiana every other yard has a huge fig tree and  every yard has a high water table.
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Ryan Zone 9a SeLa, wish list:   
Quackmaster

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Posted Reply with quote  #16 
This is my front yard and back yard is just a tad bit higher and I have 30 different in ground trees so far (soon to be a lot more) and they are happy as can be. I just avoid planting when we have plenty rains.  This is from rain yesterday.
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Ryan Zone 9a SeLa, wish list:   
Charlie

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Posted Reply with quote  #17 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quackmaster
I live below sea level and just a little rain and the water table is at the surface. Wait till it hasn't rained for a while and plant in ground. I couldn't imagine trying to raise figs in pots in the heat we have down here. Once the figs are established the water will not kill them unless they are in really low areas or you get hurricane or something. Here in south Louisiana every other yard has a huge fig tree and  every yard has a high water table.


Now there's a new thing.  Is the soil there very sandy or well draining so the water table goes down quickly after rains?
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Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas 
Quackmaster

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Posted Reply with quote  #18 
Not sandy at all charlie, it's dark fertile soil. It usually drains pretty quickly but when we start the rainy season the ground will stay saturated for weeks. I know that goes against what everyone is taught but if fig trees couldn't handle damp soil no one in south Louisiana would be able to grow a fig tree. Now I'm not saying the soil stays wet year round but a good part of the year. The more established the tree the better it can handle it.
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Ryan Zone 9a SeLa, wish list:   
m5allen

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Posted Reply with quote  #19 
Lots of good advice, good to see how other folks down south do it.  Thanks everyone.  I just found a good website to check elevation and where I want to plant the figs is 9.5 feet.  So I guess that is pretty low.  

I may be a little crazy, I went around the yard and dug a few holes in various places, some high spots and some low spots to see if it made any difference.  After about 2 feet, I got water everywhere, the higher areas near the house were a little better.  

My ground is saturated now, but it has been raining hard pretty much every day.  After a few days with no rain, it starts to dry up.  This won't be an issue in a few weeks, we are on our way out of the wet season.  We really only have 3 consistently wet months - June, July and August.  I will wait a few weeks and then fill the holes with a little pine bark compost I found and then mound up.  
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-Mike

Tampa, FL Zone 9b. Growing: Black Madeira, CDDG, Malta Black, VDB, Petite Negra, LSU Purple, Celeste, Battaglia, Alma and Grasa's Unknown Seattle Purple
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