Wax Daub & Dip Rooting Experiments

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Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1448737778 · Edited	Reply with quote #1

Some really nice cuttings of Southeastern Brown Turkey found their way into my mailbox this morning! So awesome of you Frank and now you force me to try another experiment! Have seen some folks wrap the upper part of their cuttings in parafilm. This is basically the same concept to keep the cutting from drying out and not wanting to use any humidity dome, that for some reason spells mold to me nearly 100% of the time. This is my wax pot for dipping cutting ends. It's a fry daddy with adjustable thermostat I set at 250 F and food grade cheese wax. The wax daubers hang neatly on the edge of the pot and are handy for sealing cut laterals on the side that are otherwise hard to dip. . Yeah it looks nasty, that's just stuff in the bottom from dipping mushroom log ends, bark, bug or whatever happened to fall in. I assure you it's sterile by the time I dip anything into it. So I just daubed the entire upper half of this cutting, except directly on the leaf buds. It is set into the same coarse sand I've been using, in a no-sew landscape fabric grow bag that rests inside a quart fondant container that has several drain holes drilled into the bottom. This is how it will remain until it either makes it or else. I'll dip the whole container into my fertigation mix bucket, up to the top edge of the fondant container and let it drain out either once or twice a day, to be determined. There's space between the bag and container wall so the cutting should get plenty of oxygen to it and any roots that may form. We already know they go well in sand grow bags. The container is basically for handling support. Might say it would be a lot of work to dip a bunch of quart containers once or twice a day. I agree. If I were to do a bunch, if this works out ok, I would set all them bags without the containers into a flood and drain basin and do them all at once. It would be a simple thing then. __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

Lewi

Registered:1441222269
Posts: 149

Posted 1448767479	Reply with quote #2

I found the wax dealing concept very appealing as well. So, I took a dollar store candle in a long thin glass and dipped the thin cutting in the melted wax. Might need a thicker candle for thicker cuttings in the future. __________________ West Florida (West of the Apalachiola River as defined by the proclamation of 1763). zone 8a winters can get cold for figs...down to 12 F twice in last four years. Lewi = Levite

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1448769067	Reply with quote #3

Quote: Originally Posted by Lewi I found the wax dealing concept very appealing as well. So, I took a dollar store candle in a long thin glass and dipped the thin cutting in the melted wax. Might need a thicker candle for thicker cuttings in the future. How much of the cutting did you dip? I didn't cover the buds, just daubed it on around them and only top, exposed half. So I'm curious, thinking about last year with all the single nodes going in this room and no humidity covers on anything, then recently the thin little stick of failed air layer Vasilika Sika, just stuck in the sand, now leafing. Lets add some more cuttings to this and make them dipped ends but not daubed on wax anywhere else. Three Vista. They will be dipped into the fertigation, same everything as SEBT but exposed bark uncovered with anything. I think we could squeeze in about 7 or 8 more like this. :) __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

coop951

Registered:1217167527
Posts: 596

Posted 1448775127 · Edited	Reply with quote #4

I use candle wax too and don't cover the buds. I just wax the open ends and a tiny bit of the stalk. However, I think if a bud was waxed and you removed the wax and recut the ends before rooting, it would be just fine. Up for another experiment Charlie ?? __________________ Coop Northern NJ Zone 7a

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1448776577	Reply with quote #5

Quote: Originally Posted by coop951 I use candle wax too and don't cover the buds. I just wax the open ends and a tiny bit of the stalk. However, I think if a bud was waxed and you removed the wax and recut the ends before rooting, it would be just fine. Up for another experiment Charlie ?? Sure Coop. You want me to dip a whole cutting? What if we were to dip the whole thing, and then just cut the bottom to be inserted into the media? Would it root from that cut and push buds through the wax? :) __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

tennesseefig

Registered:1447835812
Posts: 218

Posted 1448783766	Reply with quote #6

Looks nice, should work well for you! __________________ Micah 4:4But each one shall sit under his vine and under his fig tree, with no one to make them afraid, for the mouth of יְהוָה of hosts has spoken. Zone 7a, wanting: JH Adriatic, Smith, Strawberry Verte, VdB, RdB

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1448833733	Reply with quote #7

Have edited the title since this is now more than one experiment. Who knows where this will end up? Usually heat my wax to 250 F but for this addition we're staying around 200 F and have a cool pan of water close by to cool the dipped cuttings right away. So we're using a safety pin as sort of a skewer, stuck into the bottom end that's going to be cut off later. It goes easily into the soft, hollow stem core but finds resistance upon hitting that lowest node. The cutting was quickly and fully dipped, horizontally, then lifted out with skewered end up so excess wax could run off towards the upper end. It hardens almost immediately and was then dipped into the pan of cool water. The other two subjects were done the same way and the bottoms cut off very close to the lowest node on the cutting. They were then watered in to their grow bags of sand and are in the grow room. A word about types of wax. This is food grade cheese wax and it's very soft and pliable at room temperature, somewhat soft when cold. Paraffin is petroleum based, has a higher melting point, much harder and will crack easily when cold. I can always tell when somebody dipped their cutting ends in paraffin, when they arrive and pieces of wax all cracked and broken off. Kind of seems like a waste of effort to use it. Get you some cheese wax. :) Only thing for certain about this experiment now is that these cuttings are very well sealed, except for the bottoms lol. __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

rcantor

Registered:1309799312
Posts: 5,727

Posted 1448854547	Reply with quote #8

Soy wax melts at 125 and sticks well. The wax can be kept at 130 and not cause any heat damage. __________________ Zone 6, MO Wish list: Galicia Negra, De La Reina - Pons, Genovese Nero - Rafed's, Sbayi, Souadi, Acciano, Any Rimada, Sodus Sicilian, any Bass, Pons or Axier fig, any great tasting fig.

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1448884030	Reply with quote #9

Quote: Originally Posted by rcantor Soy wax melts at 125 and sticks well. The wax can be kept at 130 and not cause any heat damage. Maybe it will kill FMV. :) __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

Frankallen

Registered:1371842383
Posts: 994

Posted 1448889995 · Edited	Reply with quote #10

Looks like a very good experiment Charlie! Hopefully, this can help us all, Good luck : ) __________________ Frank from Bama- Zone 7-b Alabama .................................................... "Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever". Mahatma Gandhi

Figgyme

Registered:1424769854
Posts: 148

Posted 1448891712	Reply with quote #11

Joe_Athens1945

Registered:1396815560
Posts: 365

Posted 1448921993	Reply with quote #12

Quote: Originally Posted by coop951 I use candle wax too and don't cover the buds. I just wax the open ends and a tiny bit of the stalk. However, I think if a bud was waxed and you removed the wax and recut the ends before rooting, it would be just fine. Up for another experiment Charlie ?? Me too! __________________ Athens, GA USA Zone 7b My young trees in the ground and in pots: Brown Turkey, White Triana JM, Magnolia, Strawberry Verte, Violette de Bordeaux, Panache, UK Brooklyn Dark JP, Ronde de Bordeaux. Wish list: St Rita

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1448932955	Reply with quote #13

Quote: Originally Posted by Figgyme Yes! :) __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

coop951

Registered:1217167527
Posts: 596

Posted 1448936536	Reply with quote #14

Charlie, Your experiments are unique and interesting. Really enjoy your posts. Keep up the good work Cheers Coop __________________ Coop Northern NJ Zone 7a

Esteban_McFig

Registered:1438060476
Posts: 70

Posted 1449019827	Reply with quote #15

Noob here. Re: wax, how do you get it off the cutting when you want to take it off? Or do you? __________________ Stephen A. Phoenix, AZ (Zone 9b) Wish list: Syrian varieties, esp. Abyad, Barada, Hmari, Sefrawi, Sumaki. Ok, well also Moroccan varieties, whichever are best

SuperMario1

Registered:1441853363
Posts: 441

Posted 1449019955	Reply with quote #16

Charlie, great stuff as usual! Its funny because I have a couple in the cloner that I did similarly. I dipped the portion of the cutting that remains above the well in wax, and the rest remained uncovered. Hope both our experiments are successful! __________________ Wish list: Galicia Negra, Violetta, Violette de Sollies, Dan_la's Black Beauty 10, Craven's Craving, Most important: YOUR FAVORITE FIG. A lot of people put emphasis on popular/exotic cultivars, which is great because it highlights some of the better fig varieties; however, I am most interested in the figs our members love regardless of pedigree. Currently Growing: a bunch of varieties.

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1449020897 · Edited	Reply with quote #17

Quote: Originally Posted by Esteban_McFig Noob here. Re: wax, how do you get it off the cutting when you want to take it off? Or do you? I was thinking about that very thing today. Even though this wax is softer than paraffin, it still gets brittle when nearly freezing cold. If I was wanting to remove the wax I would get it really cold and chip it off with a knife or something. For the experiment though, it's going to stay on. In the event of bottom rotting or some other unforeseen issue, hopefully the top of the cuttings dipped fully in wax will still be good and we'll try to remove the wax and try some other crazy thing. :) __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1449021100	Reply with quote #18

Quote: Originally Posted by SuperMario1 Charlie, great stuff as usual! Its funny because I have a couple in the cloner that I did similarly. I dipped the portion of the cutting that remains above the well in wax, and the rest remained uncovered. Hope both our experiments are successful! The figs must be telling us they want us to do it. :) Really if you think about it, if we succeed it will mean more than just the results we hope for. Think about long term storage. Would they even need to be refrigerated once sealed? How long would they stay good sealed? Wax on, wax off. No more desiccated cuttings. Woohooo! :) __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

eboone

Registered:1378418906
Posts: 1,101

Posted 1449068732	Reply with quote #19

I had some with candle wax on them last year-the buds pushed the wax right off __________________ Ed Zone 6A - Southwest PA --------------------------- Short wish list: CDDG, LSU Red, Dark Greek (Navid), Col Littman's Black Cross. And any cold hardy early fig.

Lewi

Registered:1441222269
Posts: 149

Posted 1449203276 · Edited	Reply with quote #20

Charlie, I only dabbled the ends where it was clear it would loose moisture. My wife and I also put wax on the ends of some weeping willow branches she rooted..it kept the mold off the tops of the branches after trimming them agian. Both the fig cuttings and the willow seemed to benefit with increased growth after having their tops dribbled with wax ( they were already potted). Some other cuttings that will be planted in the spring are now waxed on both ends, wrapped, and in the fridge. __________________ West Florida (West of the Apalachiola River as defined by the proclamation of 1763). zone 8a winters can get cold for figs...down to 12 F twice in last four years. Lewi = Levite

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1449279657	Reply with quote #21

Here's an interesting development. De La Caseta is forming root nubs under the wax, all over the cutting. __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

SuperMario1

Registered:1441853363
Posts: 441

Posted 1449289519	Reply with quote #22

Quote: Originally Posted by Charlie Here's an interesting development. De La Caseta is forming root nubs under the wax, all over the cutting. Woa, I didn't see that coming. Soon I'll post a pic of my Alma I have on the cloner busting a bud through the wax. No roots under the wax on mine, but it is under a grow light. __________________ Wish list: Galicia Negra, Violetta, Violette de Sollies, Dan_la's Black Beauty 10, Craven's Craving, Most important: YOUR FAVORITE FIG. A lot of people put emphasis on popular/exotic cultivars, which is great because it highlights some of the better fig varieties; however, I am most interested in the figs our members love regardless of pedigree. Currently Growing: a bunch of varieties.

hoosierbanana

Registered:1287901146
Posts: 2,186

Posted 1449290377	Reply with quote #23

I think those are lenticels Charlie. They are there for gas exchange because the bark is impermeable. The cutting is adjusting their size to get more air, it can be extreme on some cuttings when you pre-root in a moist medium but doesn't seem to be a problem. __________________ 7a, DE

tennesseefig

Registered:1447835812
Posts: 218

Posted 1449295431	Reply with quote #24

Very nice, thanks for sharing. __________________ Micah 4:4But each one shall sit under his vine and under his fig tree, with no one to make them afraid, for the mouth of יְהוָה of hosts has spoken. Zone 7a, wanting: JH Adriatic, Smith, Strawberry Verte, VdB, RdB

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1449320390	Reply with quote #25

Quote: Originally Posted by hoosierbanana I think those are lenticels Charlie. They are there for gas exchange because the bark is impermeable. The cutting is adjusting their size to get more air, it can be extreme on some cuttings when you pre-root in a moist medium but doesn't seem to be a problem. This makes me think of a recent post here somewhere they wrapped the limb on a growing fig with electrical tape. __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

pino

Registered:1383190021
Posts: 2,118

Posted 1449324566	Reply with quote #26

Love to hear about your experiments! Just wondering how this eliminates the humidiy dome (or other methods of regulating humidity) for the young plants? How do you maintain the 65-80% RH (or whatever works for you)? __________________ Pino, zone 6, Niagara, JCJ Acres Wish; Peace on earth and more figs Italian 258, Galicia Negra, Luv, trade suggestions welcome.

Charlie

Registered:1404043833
Posts: 1,214

Posted 1449337015	Reply with quote #27

Quote: Originally Posted by pino Love to hear about your experiments! Just wondering how this eliminates the humidiy dome (or other methods of regulating humidity) for the young plants? How do you maintain the 65-80% RH (or whatever works for you)? Hey Pino. Well, my theory is the wax sealing the whole cutting eliminates the need for humidity cover. I've never really been concerned with humidity anyways since last year's single node experiment. They seem to grow fine without any cover and the ones under the T5 fixtures now are as well. I do have some vented cup lids over some single node cuttings in sand now, to keep from having to surface water them. The sand wicks ok up to about four inches height which is the sand depth in the grow bags and the cuttings are right under the surface. When they show activity I'll remove the lids. __________________ Zone 7A ~ Fort Smith area Arkansas

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