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mwawrzyniec

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Posted Reply with quote  #1 
Has anyone requested cuttings from UC Davis recently. I tried and was told they no longer distribute cuttings to " non-research requesters". And now when I try to access their catalog it appears to no longer be there http://www.ars-grin.gov/npgs/orders.html
smatthew

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Posted Reply with quote  #2 
Yes, there was a big change at NCGR/Davis recently. The volume of non-research requests was overwhelming their abilities. There is talk of having CRFG (California Rare Fruit Growers) and/or NAFEX (North American Fruit EXplorers) handle cutting distribution at some point in the future, but nothing yet.  
The catalog has moved.  It's a much nicer catalog view, but they haven't updated links yet. The following URL should get you there.
https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/view2.aspx?dv=web_taxonomyspecies_view_accessionlist&params=:taxonomyid=16801
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Jodi

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Posted Reply with quote  #3 
Oh thank you so much for the link.  I spent at least 15 minutes yesterday trying to find the current info.  ;-)  
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In the book the "The Meaning of Trees" it is said the fig regulates the heart and that the true essence of Figs is...food for the soul.
Daisy's IBT cuttings will be available in January/February along with a few Lampeira Parda.  
Wishes for Martinenca Rimada, Black Ischia, I258, CddRoja, Jolly Tiger, Your favorite Figgy!
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smatthew

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Posted Reply with quote  #4 
Yeah, took me about that long to find it! It is nice and shiny, and when you click on individual fig varieties it shows the observational data on the same page.
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snaglpus

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Posted Reply with quote  #5 
Searching this forum would have alieviated you guys a lot of time. Just click search then type in UC Davis for subject only and boom! Lots of info on UC Davis. Be blessed!
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Dennis
Charlotte, North Carolina/Zone 8a 
smatthew

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Posted Reply with quote  #6 
Come on dennis - maybe i just really love answering questions about NCGR Davis ;-}
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Blackberry & Fig Farmer in East Bay San Francisco - Sunol.

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snaglpus

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Posted Reply with quote  #7 
I know you do!   Ha!

How bout those figs!!!!!!
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Dennis
Charlotte, North Carolina/Zone 8a 
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Posted Reply with quote  #8 
Will they ship other stuff. Besides fig cuttings.
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wish list pananas purple,  i258,  any type of mutation
mwawrzyniec

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Posted Reply with quote  #9 
Some of the other repositories will, they are located at different universities. The ap
ple, sour cherry and grape are in Cornell.
LJFiggy

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Posted Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mwawrzyniec
Has anyone requested cuttings from UC Davis recently. I tried and was told they no longer distribute cuttings to " non-research requesters". And now when I try to access their catalog it appears to no longer be there http://www.ars-grin.gov/npgs/orders.html


Tonight, I used the link provided by smatthew and tried ordering a couple fig cuttings, along with several mulberry varieties.

When I was checking out and chose the "home gardening" option, a note popped up that said they wouldn't fill these orders. But after that, my order actually seemed to successfully go through. I even received a confirmation email.

So, does this mean they may fill my order after all? Or not...anyone know?

Also, if I needed to reorder, wonder if it would be more successful if I wrote that the plants were for "researching how different varieties work in my growing conditions", or something like that. 
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~New to growing figs, I currently have tiny fig plants which are supposedly Little Ruby, Violette de Bordeaux, Desert King, and Petite Negri. I hope these were accurately labeled!
Now rooting LSU Gold and Purple, Celeste, Panache, Peter's Honey, and Unknown Varieties from cuttings, thanks to generous forum members.

Figs on my current wish list (along with any others recommended):
Osborne Prolific, Battaglia Green, Smith, Kadota, Italian Honey, Atreano, Verte or Green Ischia, Panache, Peter's Honey, Black Madeira, Smith, Noir de Caromb, etc. ~
smatthew

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Posted Reply with quote  #11 
You'll receive a cancellation notice at some point. Sorry. And no, "researching how different varieties work in my growing conditions" was why the opened up cutting distribution to the public in the first place - but they found they couldn't handle the extra load, so only real researchers.
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waynea

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Posted Reply with quote  #12 
So Scott, being the spokesperson, and I don't mean that as sarcasm, but it seems that you are the only source we can count on, I guess, anyways since UC Davis will only send these out to CRFG who does the research on figs?? and they will distribute to only members that do research on figs?? If not then where is the original wish of UC Davis that the cuttings only end up in the hands of fig researchers?? Oh I'm sorry...."Real Researchers".
smatthew

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Posted Reply with quote  #13 

Waynea, I'm just passing along information that I've received from John Preece and others at the NCGR/Davis aka Wolfskill Experimental Orchard.  

First, a clarification. UC Davis is practically non-involved with this. Technically, the land is leased from UC Davis by the National Clonal Germplasm Repository, part of the USDA. Let's see their mission statement:

Quote:
These resources are preserved by us to ensure that these species will be available for future generations and to support research efforts in variety development and other areas of plant research.


John Preece, the head guy at Wolfskill, opened up cutting distribution to "hobby researchers" a few years ago, with the request that research data/finding be sent back to them. The number of cuttings distributed went through the roof. In fact, the volume was so high that instead of getting all the cuttings mailed out in the spring, they were still mailing in June of 2015. I'm not sure if they have ever gotten any research back. 

The simple fact is that USDA/NCGR/Davis/Wolfskill does not have enough money and staff to fulfill orders from everyone who wants cuttings. Let me repeat that - they have enough wood to fulfill 99% of orders, but lack the manpower to get orders out the door in a timely fashion.

In the past, NCGR/Davis provided fig cuttings to CRFG for scion exchanges. I believe that still happened this year, but I'll know for certain on Jan 2nd. 

In the future, you may  be able to order cuttings online though CRFG or NAFEX. I've talked with some people at the Golden Gate CRFG about making it happen. They made the excellent point that almost every variety at NCGR/Davis is available from another enthusiast. Heck, a large percentage of the NCGR/Davis collection was donated by Mr. C Todd Kennedy of the CRFG. So while NCGR/Davis was the _cheapest_ fig cutting source, it's not the only one.

Who counts as a researcher? I believe universities and non-profits count.

BTW - I have and share this info for a number of reasons. Wolfskill is amazingly beautiful. I attend every fruit tasting there that I find out about. And I went to farm school like a mile down the road. It's an amazing resource that this country has. If you live in the area, you can email John Preece and he will take people on tours of wolfskill. He has to drive around and check everything occasionally, and it appears that he enjoys showing off the collection. 
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Bluemalibu

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Posted Reply with quote  #14 

  Scott,  thanks so much, for the enlightening clarification of the Wolfskill operation!

  Blue
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HarveyC

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Posted Reply with quote  #15 
The president of our Sacramento chapter of CRFG has for many years ordered some various cuttings from the NCGR for distribution to five NorCal CRFG chapters.  Figs have not usually been requested as most seemed like our supply at annual exchanges was already adequate, though I recall we received 'Sierra' two years ago.  I'm a part of this chapter's advisory team and I made sure that we requested several of the top fig varieties (none of this is for my own use).  We won't know what we actually get until they get picked up sometime next week and then they will get split up among five chapters at the "cutting party" (maybe about 40 volunteers that cut wood into appropriate sizes and put into labeled bags, the "party" part comes in mostly from the potluck lunch).  I've suggested that we take some steps to try to ensure that cuttings go to people that we know have a serious interest in growing them so that they don't go to waste.  I won't be around for the cutting party as I'll be enjoying a vacation some place much warmer. :)

Some people have expressed interest in CRFG distributing cuttings but I don't see that happening.  I'm a member of four chapters and everybody is already putting out so much effort to just do what they already do.  Storage of a large quantity of cuttings and distributing to lots of folks around the country was a task that NCGR with paid staff found extremely difficult to do and it's not realistic to expect volunteers to be able to do this, IMHO.

I have a diverse pomegranate orchard which I am going to remove to make room for more chestnuts and grow "only" 16 varieties for my own use.  Lots of folks were interested in making sure that my material was preserved and the call was put out for help to come collect cuttings Wednesday of this week.  John V from the Golden Gate chapter headed up the effort.  In the end, only John and two other of my friends from the Sacramento chapter showed up and worked for five hours collecting a large load (filled a pickup bed) of cuttings.  These will also get taken to the cutting party for distribution where volunteers get to put in more of their time.

The sad thing about these exchanges is that maybe only five percent of the folks that come bring something to exchange and we are pretty sure that a large percentage of the scions/cuttings never get grafted/rooted.

As of this last week the mood at NCGR is that they might not want anybody out in their orchards again.  Apparently they let someone from a nursery go out and and they accidentally damaged some irrigation equipment and didn't bother to report it.  This has happened before and I heard NCGR staff is very upset this has happened again.  Too many people don't show adequate respect for what they have going there.

Todd Kennedy did indeed provide quite a bit of the material that is at Wolfskill now but he is not a good source for cuttings.  Due to drought and no irrigation water supply, many of his own trees died the past two years.  Todd was generous with his time in helping increase the diversity at Wolfskill.  I and some others have donated smaller amounts and I would suggest that others consider doing the same to help ensure this material is preserved.  Material is preserved as live specimens in the field, new plants in greenhouses, and cuttings in refrigeration.
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Harvey - Correia Farms
Isleton, CA (Sacramento County) USDA zone 9b, Sunset zone 14

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brianm

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Posted Reply with quote  #16 
See you there on the 17th. I will be bringing cuttings.
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smatthew

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Posted Reply with quote  #17 
There's also a bit of interest - at least at Golden Gate, of doing some tracking of cuttings and where they end up 1)so the owners can be asked for cuttings later, and 2) to actually see where varieties do well. Maybe an occasional "We list you as having cultivars x,y, and z. Do you a) still have them b) have they fruited c) Thumbs up or Thumbs down"
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Blackberry & Fig Farmer in East Bay San Francisco - Sunol.

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waynea

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Posted Reply with quote  #18 
Good info Scott, thanks.
waynea

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Posted Reply with quote  #19 
Thanks for the info Harvey, sounds like the CRFG has an extensive operation/activities and some really dedicated members, but I really couldn't see them taking on the task of the distribution of cuttings if it is such a burden and demanding task for NCGR.
HanburyHouse

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Posted Reply with quote  #20 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarveyC


The sad thing about these exchanges is that maybe only five percent of the folks that come bring something to exchange and we are pretty sure that a large percentage of the scions/cuttings never get grafted/rooted.

.


With CRFG, I never felt a need to order from Wolfskill. I didn't relized how blessed we are in Calif. to have an organization like it, And now with Wolfskill ending distributions to hobby gardeners I will certainly appreciate them all the more.

I haven't gone to any NorCal CRFG scion exchanges, but some of the Socal chapters encourage members to bring scion wood to share by giving members first dibs for a short period if they brought scions. Do the Norcal chapters do that? I hope the numbers are higher than what you mentioned for the scions to geting used. The selections are always amazing and that would be an awful shame.

I like smatthew's idea for a database. I would sign up my stuff.

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smatthew

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Posted Reply with quote  #21 
If another organization starts doing scion distribution, I assume a number of changes would occur including **charging Shipping & Handling costs**. I think that alone would cut the number of requests in half.

**waynea** HarveyC is much more knowledgeable about this than me.
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waynea

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Posted Reply with quote  #22 
Good info from both of you, thanks.
HarveyC

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Posted Reply with quote  #23 
So far, nobody has stepped up to suggest that they might volunteer to distribute cuttings from NCGR so I can't speculate about S&H charges, but it certainly couldn't be done for free.  Even to submit the request there was an absence of someone stepping up to take that over so the same person who has submitted tiny requests in the past did it.  Honestly, there would have been zero fig cuttings requested from CRFG if I didn't put a list together and give it to him.  Also, there's a question as to what quantity CRFG will even get from NCGR.  There is no way to predict what demand will be and NCGR has usually just provided a modest quantity to share for some individual chapter exchanges so it will be interesting to see what happens this next week.

HanburyHouse: the SCV and Sacramento chapters do give members first entrance into exchanges but there is never a requirement that members provide cuttings to share, just a lot of begging/reminding.  The lines at the entrance door can be quite large and only a small number of folks have cuttings in their hands brought to share.

Andy Mariani is a premier stone fruit grower in Morgan Hill and he opens up his commercial orchard to CRFG every year and yesterday a good sized group spent the good part of the day collecting scions which will again be shared among NorCal exchanges.  These and other cuttings actually go beyond there with material gathered up from 5 NorCal exchanges, then taken to the San Luis Obispo exchange in February, and then sent off to a Texas rarefruit chapter of CRFG for sharing there.

Most members know that I sell cuttings and trees but I've donated various types of cuttings to several CRFG exchanges for many years and last year I also donated about 10 fig trees in 5 gallon pots to be added to the Prusch Park orchard for later sharing of material at exchanges.  One member had collected white sapote scions and brought them to the SCV exchange last year where they were quickly snatched up even though he controlled the distribution.  He sent me an email that night at 8pm asking if I could help in some way for the GG exchange the next day so from 9-11pm I was out collecting from my own white sapote trees.  No boasting is intended by this but it is just an example of how a small number of people can pull together and make big things happen, though it sure would be even much greater if more folks helped.  Oh, I have been accused a couple of times of just being in it for the money. :)
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Harvey - Correia Farms
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