OK, so I see on here fairly frequently that a number of members really dislike Brown Turkey. Some say it is bland, watery, tastes like (fill in the blank). Actually, some assessments I've read fall just short of calling BT's fruit Seething Pustules de Satan (SPdS BT for notation purposes). So my questions are:

1) Does everyone really hate this variety?

2) If you do, indeed, like eating BT, how so - fresh, dried, etc.?

3) If BT is so very loathsome, why does it still get offered by so many retailers and growers? Seems like it is everywhere.

I'm just curious, because I generally have liked every fig I have tasted. Sure, some are absolutely superior to others, but I just wonder if BT deserves the widespread disdain. Thanks.

only BT i had was few i got from a super market. so they might not be the best sample i could have tried. however, they did not have much taste to it. slightly sweet, but nothing impressive. rather bland.

then my VdB and paradiso gene riped. the contrast was so great between the BT and others, i wouldn't want to waste my limited space at home with BT.

i heard english brown turkey or some such is great.

pete

It was probably the first fresh fig I ate. It was delicious. Taste is personal, opinions are abundant, and growing conditions vary greatly. Enjoy!

John,

I think it's similar to what you see with the fruits that are available at the supermarket.  They are selected and grown for a variety of characteristics, including, color, susceptibility to disease, size, shape, keeping ability, shipping ability, yield, etc.  Way down towards of the bottom of the list is something called flavor.  Most of the folks on this forum would probably place flavor almost at the top of the list for any fruit or fig, so in that sense we are not your "average" consumers or growers. 

BT grows well in most climates (at least relative to other figs), is easy to propagate, yields a large crop, etc.  Seems to me it's the red delicious of figs. 

My sister has a BT tree in FL that produces a huge crop each year, most of which are eaten by yellow jackets, etc after they fall off.  She doesn't like them that much, certainly not enough to eat the bushels that ripen each year.  I tried them, and they're not that great fresh.  However, she dried a few and sent them to me, and I ate them all in about 10 minutes.

Maybe it's just my personal taste.  I think that the figs with the milder flavor when fresh are better candidates for drying, because the dried figgy flavor can be overwhelming if it is too strong. 

John.....

It may not be the best tasting fig that you can grow, but any figs are better than no figs.  Come to your own conclusions, and try to get the most from this variety by learning how to grow it with the best culture that you can provide, especially, as the figs ripen.

The United States in my opinion, has consistently grown some of the worst fresh produce, especially fruit, compared to other countries, unless you search out heirloom varieties that were selected for flavor.  We eat apples that taste like raw potatoes, waxy tomatoes, sour grapes, dry, pasty peaches -  that rot in 15 minutes, etc, etc.  Meat is too lean, pork tastes like cardboard.

Don't worry about your Brown Turkey figs....just enjoy.

Frank

The Red Delicious analogy was perfect. And I agree with you all when it comes to our food in most stores. I suffer through the mealy tomatoes each winter until I can grow heirloom varieties that are far more enjoyable. And it never fails to frustrate me when the peaches go bad as soon as they ripen.

I wonder if the milder figs improve with drying, as the flavors get intensified with the removal of the water. Makes sense to me. I would think you would see a similar concentration in jams.

Most of my 20 or so fig trees are still too young to give an accurate assessment, but the two oldest (10+ years) are a Black Mission and an "Improved Brown Turkey" from a local nursery. For several years, the BT was my favorite of the two. The fruit was bigger, more abundant, and the season was much longer. The tree grew faster and was less affected by frost, which has knocked the BM back nearly to the ground a couple of times. Most important, at least to my unsophisticated palate, was that the BT tasted better. I don't know--maybe they develop better flavor in Tucson's heat, or maybe the nursery mislabeled it and it's something entirely different (which I doubt), but I thought it was a great fig. Until....

I think that people dislike Brown Turkey's because of their reputed lack of flavor. In the south, Brown Turkey's and Celeste figs are commonly turned into fig preserves, where they are delicious. I recommend letting your turkey's ripen well for fresh eating and making preserves with the rest. BT preserves make great Christmas gifts in a mason jar with a nice ribbon. I have heard that the Maryland BT, or Maryland Berry is a better fig. It looks very different from the long BT. I don't think there is truely a "trash" variety of fig available. All figs give so much with so little. Like grapes, I think figs may need a little neglect to produce the best tasting fruit.

My only experience with Brown Turkey is from store bought figs. They tasted like a mixture of cucumber and cardboard, with a little bit of sugar. That being said, I've heard there are some really good strains: English, Vern's, etc + close relatives (Bayernfeive Violetta, Sweet George, etc).

I think the popularity is part due to ease of propagation, part due to confusion (Brown Turkey being almost a generic name for figs), and part due to the fact that either people who sell it don't taste the fruit, or that we are all used to visually perfect but tasteless produce.

If you have a brown turkey in a pot, bring it in before the fall rains start and keep it under halogen lights with the minimum amount of water daily.  No flooding then drying out. Do this until all the fruit ripens then slowly let it grow dormant.  If it's outside keep as much water off of it as you can until it ripens its fruit.  (obviously don't let it get too dry)

Store bought figs will never be a good taste test because they are picked before they are truly ripe.

For me, Brown Turkey just lacks flavor and sweetness. They may do better in very hot climates that can push a higher level of flavor and sugar. With so many great tasting figs, what is the point of wasting time, energy, space, water, etc. on a fig that if less that top quality,

The varieties that are sold depend on a  number of factors: what a nursery actually produces (which is affected by what sells, what they have cuttings for, what large orchards are planting, etc.), what people buy (which is affected  by what is available, what they are used to, etc, etc.).

You will always see cherries and high chill apples for sale in Southern California nurseries where they have no hope of producing fruit - but people buy the, so they sell them.

The only Brown Turkeys that I've eaten were bought in a store. One of the times I got them they were good. They must of been picked near the peak of ripeness. Another time I got them they were really bland tasting to the point that I left them in the fridge for at least a week before I ate them. They were not as good as the other time but they were edible. I think that when they are store bought it just depends on how close to full ripeness they are when picked that will give them their best taste possible. It's basically the luck of the draw.  I don't have a brown turkey tree and not really going out of my way to look for one either. But I wouldn't mind trying one if I got it in a trade.

There are many different strains of BT out there. They were my first fig. Those in your grocer are California BT fig and like Jon stated, they were picked before they were ripe and they will never ripen so, naturally they taste horrible. However, BTs in my area are sweet but not rich. English BTs are excellent in my area. There is a tree about a mile from my house. Every year this tree produces many large semi-dried brebras that taste like super sweet candy. Dr Leon and a few others have a BT variety called Hanc Mathis BT. This one is suppose to be a good one too. There's another one out there called Vern's BT that is suppose to be good too. I have one but it has not fruited yet. I think it is a matter of taste. But when you compare BT to the taste of Smith, Black Maderia, Negronne, RdB, Alma, Gino's, Kathleen Black....the list goes on and on. Well, there is just no comparison! But they are fun to eat.

I think Daniel (pylot) and Jon (pitangadiego) nailed it on the head, but I'll toss in some personal opinion and experience.

I think a major part of the problem is name confusion.  Specifically, The name Brown Turkey is so widely recognized that it ends up being improperly used all the time - in the produce section at the store, in the orchard/yard, and at the nursery.   

Mutations, genetic similarities and climate they're grown in could also have some bearing on it, but I think those issues are dwarfed by name confusion.

For examples of those three places and how they cause problems...

At home, your average person (like, 99% of the world) doesn't know anything about figs.  The name Brown Turkey has become interchangable with "fig" to them for a numer of reasons.  After telling some people I grow figs at home, I've actually gotten the response, "Oh, you grown brown turkeys?!" ... they actually believe that every fig is a Brown Turkey.  I've also bumped into home growers in Atlanta who actually have Celeste trees, but they call it a Brown Turkey because the fruit is brown (!!!) - after all, "it's brown skinned, so it MUST be a Brown Turkey", they tell me.  Again - general ignorance.  Big problem.

Several people have been shocked when I tell them that Brown Turkey figs are actually purple/green when ripe, then their jaw drops when I inform them there are well over a dozen different fig fruit colors and I'm growing several dozen varieties at home. They're floored when I tell them there are hundreds of varieties to grow.  I honestly believe this is probably how we end up with awesome varieties like Brown Turkey MD - that is, someone has a fig that's not actually a Brown Turkey, but they call it a Brown Turkey, then cuttings and suckers are shared, and before you know it, everyone thinks Brown Turkey is awesome because of this one person's mistake.  We end up with names like "English" Brown Turkey, "Improved" Brown Turkey, "California Brown Turkey", etc. which I personally doubt are actually a Brown Turkey, but who knows anymore?

At the produce section or farmers market, the customer's familiarity with the Brown Turkey name lends to fig fruit being incorrectly labeled as Brown Turkey to help sell the fruit.  After all, names and familiarity sell - with names in particular, how many people have you met that buy a fig tree because it's labelled "Strawberry" or "Raspberry Latte"?  The visual you get when you hear those names is pretty powerful. 

I've seen our local stores AND farmers markets selling Celeste figs as Brown Turkey on a number of occasions.  When I bring this mis-naming issue up with them, they nod and smile, but I'll come back the following week only to find they're STILL labeled Brown Turkey - they usually don't care.  This pigheaded mentality undoubtedly leads to buyers loving the taste of "Brown Turkey" (after all, Celeste is a pretty good fig) and they run to the nursery to ask for their own "Brown Turkey" tree.

I think retail nurseries are most to blame.  The familiarity of the name Brown Turkey means trees that actually aren't Brown Turkey end up being labeled and sold as Brown Turkey because it's the popular/familiar name customers ask for.  Again, the name sells, and most nurseries are looking to sell fruit trees, not a reputation, so they don't understand or care about the importance of variety.  I believe this is how we end up with some pretty awesome figs being labeled as Brown Turkey, but very unlikely to be an actual Brown Turkey.  Stores like Home Depot and Lowes are often to blame for us in the southeast, but other major chains have been just as bad.  Sometimes it's not their fault - their source mislabels - it's unfortunate.

When you consider this, is it any wonder some people say they've had good tasting Brown Turkey figs?  Hell, they may have actually been eating a Black Mission, Celeste or Black Jack fig instead (noteworthy: Black Jack and Black Mission were found to be genetically similar to Brown Turkey by UCD some time ago).

It's worth noting that my only personal gauge on what Brown Turkey is would be the tree I have from Monrovia (a grower), which has many of the general documented characteristics of Brown Turkey, including the sweetness, wateriness, complete lack of richness, fruit color, interior void and color, fruit size, dominant leaf shapes, cold tolerance, growth habits, etc.  It really is a piss-poor fig in the flavor department.  There are dozens of better tasting figs out there with similar or better growth habits that it makes absolutely no sense to grow an actual Brown Turkey fig in my opinion.

Reality is, my Brown Turkey from Monrovia may not be a Brown Turkey at all, so I could be spreading misinformation - Gorgi brought this point up recently (i.e "how do we really know what is actually a Brown Turkey"?). 

In my case, my Monrovia Brown Turkey it sure tastes worthless, though, regardless of whether you dehydrate it (it helps, but not enough), cook it or preserve it, so I've considered trashing it on a number of occasions.  I'm just not sure if anything will grow well in the spot I've got it.

[URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/233/cookingbtf1280.jpg/][IMG]http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/3614/cookingbtf1280.th.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

    I eat Brown Turkey fig preserves almost everyday.IMO the weather conditions,over watering ,and when the figs are picked will determine whether a BT fig is not fit to eat or with good flavor. I didn't water my large in ground BT fig once last year and the figs turned out well. My small fig trees require more care  in regards to watering or their health can deteriorate in a short time in hot and dry conditions,more so if they are in containers.

   An over watered fig tree will produce a bloated fig with diluted flavor and sweetness and a fig that is picked green has no potential for flavor or sweetness either. I have noticed a number of different varieties of fig photos posted on the forum that appear to have been picked green.

Ideally,I prefer to eat figs that have ripened to the point that the neck goes limp.This isn't always possible due to rain coming,birds,squirrels,or insects and you have to weigh the pros and cons of when to pick in order to best utilize your fig crop.

  

   

    

  

satellitehead/Jason....et al.

Interesting explanation re: the "real" Brown Turkey.  The last part is actually the most interesting referring to Celeste, Black-Jack, and Mission varieties, being closely linked by similar DNA. 
I've never tasted a Celeste, nor would I ever waste my time growing this variety, given that when "stressed", this variety will drop its figs.  In my mind...a perfect waste of time and growing space.

I have a question:
When fresh figs are sold in stores, are we buying  breba figs, or, are they selling main-crop figs.  Maybe the flavor sucks because we are eating lousy, breba figs?

Frank

[QUOTE]When fresh figs are sold in stores, are we buying  breba figs, or, are they
selling main-crop figs.  Maybe the flavor sucks because we are eating lousy,
breba figs?
[/QUOTE]

My guess would be both. They sell whenever there is a market for the product. Taste is rarely the priority, staying in business is. I can't blame them.

Many times there is an inverse relationship between flavor and price, particularly for fruits that can't be held in storage for very long.  Price is a function of supply and demand.  For most consumers, demand is pretty constant throughout the year.  However, the supply, and the hemisphere in which the fruits are grown, fluctuate quite a bit.  Most of Florida's strawberries ripen during a relatively short period.  During this time, since there is abundant supply (most years), the price goes down.  To me, a ripe February FL strawberry tastes way better than the ones they grow in CA throughout the year.

Similar to the east coast grown blueberries.  There is a premium paid if you can get your blueberries to ripen earlier than everyone else's.  During the height of the summer season,  when all the berries are ripening, there is a lot of supply of good berries that were grown fairly locally, and the price are good.  If you try to buy blueberries in January, they probably were grown in South or Central America and spent a long time on a boat before you get to eat them.  Often they have little flavor. 

So, if a breba crop ripens early, perhaps there is a premium for it.  On the other hand, if people aren't used to buying them at that time, there may be no market at all. 

[QUOTE=Gr8Figs]IMO the weather conditions,over watering ,and when the figs are picked will determine whether a BT fig is not fit to eat or with good flavor. 
[/QUOTE]

I never water my BT.  Been through a number of crops in a number of conditions. In all forms, in all levels of ripeness, under all conditions, absolultely mediocre at its best.  Out of 76 varieties I have, it always tastes bottom and far below the worst of my worst.  My BT is in-ground as well, and is 5-6 years with a trunk caliper of 8", well-pruned and taken care of.  This is, unfortunately, the same story of 11 BT trees within a mile or two of my home I've found, so I'm biased.

[QUOTE=BronxFigs]I've never tasted a Celeste, nor would I ever waste my time growing this variety, given that when "stressed", this variety will drop its figs.
[/QUOTE]

There are a ton of Celeste strains. Only some of them drop fruit in heat or stress, and most of the ones that drop under heat or stress stop doing so after becoming established. One of special things about Celeste is many strains are capable of figs drying on the tree without rotting, which can be awesome.

Are those other 11 BTs planted in the shade as well? Also, air conditioners drip constantly when running, so you are watering it every time you use the AC, your tree has roots under them fo sho.

I've been following this thread with interest, especially the stuff about how "brown turkey" has become a generic name and is probably misidentified all too frequently.  (i.e. what Jon, satellitehead, pylot and others wrote above... sounds right to me). Since joining this forum about a month ago, one of the things I've been hoping to do is to get some help identifying the fig cultivar that my dad has been growing for 40 years.  He got it from a guy in Buffalo NY and was told it was "brown turkey".  But from looking online and reading all of this, I don't think it really is BT.  But what is it?  I'm waiting to get some figs this year, so I can post photos and maybe get a little bit of help.  Maybe it'll be a lost cause identifying if I can't do some actual DNA analysis (and I can't do that myself), but I'd like to try identifying anyway.  Is photographing the fruit and leaves likely to be of any help with identifying a cultivar?  (I read elsewhere on here that the leaves aren't really so helpful because they vary so much).  And maybe also by describing the growing characteristics/habits?  Or is it a lost cause to try to identify them?

Brent:  I capture my A/C condensate.  They aren't watered.  I can't speak to the other trees, but based on the landscape at the properties for half of them, I can tell you that nobody bothers to water or tend to anything in those yards.  Seems that it doesn't matter whether people take care of them or not - in this particular climate, BT tastes like crap.  I can't speak to anything outside the metro ATL area, because I don't live elsewhere.

EDIT:  Just to be positive, I wanted to add that in my particular climate/area, Hardy Chicago, Adriatic (JH Adriatic at least), Beall, and Marseilles Black are a thousand times more tasty than Brown Turkey. I honestly believe anyone who tried one of these figs shortly after tasting the best possible domestically grown "true" Brown Turkey would put the Brown Turkey tree in a chipper without question (if asked).  Exceptionally good tasting figs don't end up being jams and preserves.  They get eaten before you can get them into the pot.  ;)

All these negative comments on the BT makes me anxious to taste the other varieties that I have growing. I have always found the BT to be quite tasty and if it really tastes bad I can't imagine what good is.

I read an article recently on commercial mass-grown tomatoes. Apparently, they are picked completely green to better withstand shipping/handling/storing etc, with little consideration for flavor.
I would imagine that figs, which are more fragile, would be even harder to ship etc..

John,

At least tomatoes will ripen after picking, but most figs won't.  Plus, those tomatoes are usually always tasteless because they are mainly breeds that are tough and will withstand shipping.

noss

Ah the poor Brown Turkey, much maligned and considered inferior. It certainly is the "turkey" of the fig world. I guess it is a victim of our fig snobbishness. I've tasted fresh picked BT and enjoyed them thoroughly. Granted they are not the filet mignon of figs, there are plenty of candidates for that, but a fresh one tastes pretty good to me. Of course I also enjoy ground chuck and realize I am less discriminating than most here as to fig taste. If I had only one tree, that would not be my choice, but it does have some merit. Fairly hardy and productive anyway. A good fig for non fig fanatics at the very least. I wonder if Benjamin Franklin would aprove.

I believe my Grandparents had two BTs in their back yard and I loved the figs, which maybe means they were not BTs?  I'll never know...

noss

bump.

I just love Jason's description of how a BT fig taste.  Everytime I read this....I can't stop laughing!

UC Davis Brown Turkey and Callie Brown Turkey are 2 excellent tasting figs.  They are a 10!  But they are caprified.  Jason, my Black Jack fits your taste description but the brebas do not.

This is still very funny to read.

To steal a line................."A fig by any other name is still a fig'

I feel that a comment here is required, a Vidalia onion only tastes like a Vidalia onion if grown in a very small area of Georgia, Vidalia, the cultivar does not taste the same when grown in different areas.  They are sweet and similar in taste but not the same.  For use in a salad they all are better than a yellow spanish, cooked in Gumbo, the yellow is far better.  All stated in the opinion of my unique taste buds.

BT may be very valuable as a rootstock.  I just ordered the 25 cuttings for $10 on ebay (At least I don't have to worry that I might get a BT as a fraud) and plan to graft on it as soon as it roots.  I know others are ahead of me in this.

[QUOTE=rcantor]BT may be very valuable as a rootstock.  I just ordered the 25 cuttings for $10 on ebay (At least I don't have to worry that I might get a BT as a fraud) and plan to graft on it as soon as it roots.  I know others are ahead of me in this.[/QUOTE]

Interesting... I had the same idea. How soon can we graft them? Does it depends on the number of leaves, root volume, age, etc..
I have one wild fig growing in my garden, I grafted 4 varieties this year. The wilds are so strong!

Hi, I grafted on my bt fig cuttings  before i put them in the moss, the only grafts I lost where on cuttings that did not root. Rex

Glad it was worthy of a chuckle, Dennis ;)