This mix recipe is currently under test...


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Rich it looks good.  What's the recipe? :)

What's in there?

Thanks for asking Charlie, but until I get a little more data on it I'll just post pictures and observations.

My goal was for the cost to be about $2 per cubic foot.

Oh it's a secret recipe!  Ok lol it still looks good.  I wish you well with it.

Let's see how it works before we let the cat out of the bag

Not another researcher with secrets. I am still trying to find Black Ischia w/out FMV.

Teasing is not nice, Rich.

:-)

Should work great, as you know these trees are great survivors, some grow upsidedown with roots in rocks, or palm trees.  I would think any soil that contains leaves, bark would be a better place to grow roots than rock.

The mixture looks nice Rich. Perhaps you can share the recipe with us after experimenting with them. Norhayati

I've used the following mix ; 1 part peat moss , 2 parts garden soil and 1 part perlite. It works great with figs.
I've also used Moisture control potting mix from Home depot. It also works great.

[QUOTE=Norhayati]The mixture looks nice Rich. Perhaps you can share the recipe with us after experimenting with them. Norhayati[/QUOTE]

Yes Thats what I was planning to do.

Wood chips/hardwood mulch, peat, perlite, and possibly some sand and compost.

Mystery solved!

Careful with wood chips all, I've done that and they always go under my fingernails when potting/mixing. Hurts like an SOB.

[QUOTE=Ampersand]Wood chips/hardwood mulch, peat, perlite, and possibly some sand and compost.

Mystery solved!

Careful with wood chips all, I've done that and they always go under my fingernails when potting/mixing. Hurts like an SOB.[/QUOTE]

Close...

I found out about the slivers already. Ouch.

Should also add its a "soil less" mix.

I'd use caution with the wood chips. When that starts to break down the fungal decay process will suck all the available nitrogren out of the mix and render it unavailable to the plants. Bark decays at a much slower rate which is what it is usually used. But good luck all the same.

Yes. I have had discussions about nitrogen drawdown with several people as well read many papers about it.

With the weekly fertilization that we do there would be plenty of nitrogen available for decomposition and for the plant

It takes 1-2 pounds of nitrogen per cubic yard of soft wood bark to compost it.

http://www.uaex.edu/publications/pdf/FSA-6097.pdf

Mine is no secret...

1 large bag of MG potting mix or Daddy Pete's
1 5g bucket of Cow manure
1 5g bucket of  Mushroom compost
1 5g bucket of perlite
1 5g bucket of top soil
1 bag of soil conditioner (just pine bark fines)
2 cups of pelletized lime

I also mix other bags of potting mix depending what Ihave on hand at the time.  In my opinion, it all turns to dirt over time!

I like that blend, Dennis. I usually toss in some sort of compost material into to my mix as well. Do you ever have weed problems from the mushroom soil? I work down the road from the Giorgio mushroom plants...a lot of locals won't take the mushroom soil due to weed problems.

Thanks for sharing Dennis. Nice mix.

Could you just clarify the second ingredient line, "1 5g bucket of both Cow manure"?

A couple more reference links

http://www.gardenguides.com/99097-miracle-gro-potting-mix-ingredients.html

http://www.extension.org/pages/20982/organic-potting-mix-basics#.VBsQ6pRdVYB

Comparing water holding and retention of Super Mega Mix to MG based mixed I used this summer.

Both weighed 13.2 lbs for the last 2 days

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The only weed problems I get is whenever I use dry organic fertilizer. Never, ever again will I use that stuff! The weeds in that stuff grew taller than my figs! I - 5g of both cow manure and mushroom compost. Too me, mushrrom compost and cow manure is the same. But I do still use them both. My 5 gallon bucket is my guide. A 1 cubic bag of compost is around 5 gallons. hope this helps......

Today I weighed both containers. The results were the same 11.4 lbs Rich's Mega Mix appears to have settled about 10% less than the MG based mix

Another interesting link with a soil recipe - grows figs too

http://www.threefoldfarm.org/blog/making-your-own-potting-mix

Rich,
Al Tapla's 5-1-1 mix has been used successfully for years by many forum members, some with personalized modifications as noted in your attached link, http://www.threefoldfarm.org/blog/making-your-own-potting-mix . Tapla in his postings also recommended personalized modifications as needed. His recipe was 5 parts Pine bark Fines - 1 Part Peat Moss - 1 Part Perlite, His Gritty mix recipe had also been posted but has not been popular since it dries out very quickly.

My modification to the 5-1-1- mix was to add 1 part Calcined Clay (or Calcined Diatomaceous earth), Napa Floor Dry or Tractor Supply Oil absorbent. This created a 5-1-1-1 mix and has been used successfully for the past 3 years, http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/show_single_post?pid=1278563825&postcount=16 .

Fig trees can be grown in almost any mix, the major requirements are that it be well aerated, fast draining, but able to hold sufficient moisture between watering. Any Regular potting mix can be used when added parts of sifted perlite or sifted perlite and sifted Calcined clay are used. 4 parts Potting Mix - 1 part sifted perlite - 1 part sifted Calcines clay is a good mix to start and uses materials that are readily available.

BTW, sifting is simply removing the dust and small particles. A window screen is all that would be needed...

Please keep us updated on the use of your mix...

[QUOTE=ascpete]Rich,
Al Tapla's 5-1-1 mix has been used successfully for years by many forum members, some with personalized modifications as noted in your attached link, http://www.threefoldfarm.org/blog/making-your-own-potting-mix . Tapla in his postings also recommended personalized modifications as needed. His recipe was 5 parts Pine bark Fines - 1 Part Peat Moss - 1 Part Perlite, His Gritty mix recipe had also been posted but has not been popular since it dries out very quickly.

My modification to the 5-1-1- mix was to add 1 part Calcined Clay (or Calcined Diatomaceous earth), Napa Floor Dry or Tractor Supply Oil absorbent. This created a 5-1-1-1 mix and has been used successfully for the past 3 years, http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/show_single_post?pid=1278563825&postcount=16 .

Fig trees can be grown in almost any mix, the major requirements are that it be well aerated, fast draining, but able to hold sufficient moisture between watering. Any Regular potting mix can be used when added parts of sifted perlite or sifted perlite and sifted Calcined clay are used. 4 parts Potting Mix - 1 part sifted perlite - 1 part sifted Calcines clay is a good mix to start and uses materials that are readily available.

BTW, sifting is simply removing the dust and small particles. A window screen is all that would be needed...

Please keep us updated on the use of your mix...[/QUOTE]

Hi Pete, Yes I have read alot about Taplas mix. Thanks.
My mix is a little different.

fyi
Pine bark mulch that resembles pine bark fines ? Can be found at Agway in Morristown NJ
Im picking up a couple bags later this week to see..

http://www.agway.com/catalog/home_and_garden/mulches/pine/10202313_agway_pine_bark_mulch_3_cuft.html

Rich- I have bought those bags before from that agway and the material was perfect straight out of the bag. I grow everything in 5-1-1 and usually add an extra half of peat depending on the amount of fine material in the bark.

[QUOTE=Figinqueens]Rich- I have bought those bags before from that agway and the material was perfect straight out of the bag. I grow everything in 5-1-1 and usually add an extra half of peat depending on the amount of fine material in the bark. [/QUOTE]

Thanks for sharing. You are on the same track as I am with adding more peat.
At this point I'm considering the differences in growth of our figs that could be caused by a more coarse bark mix or a smaller more uniform bark mix in our soil-less mix.

Not to de-rail the thread but...
Is there a proven mix using aged cow or horse manure? That is readily available to me and cheap. I was thinking 50% manure, 25% peat, and 25% pearlite. ( plus lime).

I believe the mix the Dennis (Snaglpus) posted makes use of manure, I used his mix last year and have been very happy with the results.

[QUOTE=ADelmanto]Not to de-rail the thread but... Is there a proven mix using aged cow or horse manure? That is readily available to me and cheap. I was thinking 50% manure, 25% peat, and 25% pearlite. ( plus lime). [/QUOTE]

Tapla had mentioned on GW he doesn't like composts/manures because it tends to compact and results in a perched water table. Myself, I don't use more than couple handfuls of compost in a pot. Maybe it would be useful as a topdressing, though?

After googling "perched water table" I can see that you would not want to plant in pure compost or manure. It is my experience that this material tends to get super dry and is difficult to rehydrate. My only reason for wanting to use it is it's cheap. I will be up potting about 60 pots this spring from 3 to 15 gal pots. That's a lot of potting soil.
For 50% of my mix I was thinking compost, mushroom soil, or manure. The rest is pearlite and peat moss. Of those 3 what would be the best?

[QUOTE=ADelmanto]After googling "perched water table" I can see that you would not want to plant in pure compost or manure. It is my experience that this material tends to get super dry and is difficult to rehydrate. My only reason for wanting to use it is it's cheap. I will be up potting about 60 pots this spring from 3 to 15 gal pots. That's a lot of potting soil. For 50% of my mix I was thinking compost, mushroom soil, or manure. The rest is pearlite and peat moss. Of those 3 what would be the best?[/QUOTE]

Too much peat can also result in the perched water table as the mix settles and breaks down. Can you find pine bark fines? They will work a lot better than any items you mentioned and last a lot longer. That being said, my 2 cents would to use well composted manure (several years old) or the compost. I work down the road from the Giorgio mushroom factory, sometimes employees come to the garden center I work in and want nothing to due with mushroom soil because they (apparently) use a lot of chemicals. Mushroom soil is basically just manure composted with straw, FYI.

While I totally understand the cost issue, potting mix isn't something I'd try to skimp on. Healthy roots mean healthy fruits!

I should have thrown pine bark fines in the new mix formula as well. I have a half a pallet of it. $250 per pallet though. Thanks for the advice.

If you're looking for pine bark fines, go to Lowes or Home Depot and ask for a soil conditioner.  At Home Depot, its called Water Saver or Nature's Helper or Clay buster.  All it is Pine Bark fines.  Also, the Miracle Grow for tree and shrubs is mostly pine bark fines too.  It pays to experiement.  I've played with a lot of different soils mixes.  Some say Cow manure and Mushroom compost is the same but it isn't.  Bill from Bill's figs uses pure mushroom compost for his trees.  Al's mix is great and trees grow well in it, but I can't use that stuff for my self watering pots.

[QUOTE=snaglpus]If you're looking for pine bark fines, go to Lowes or Home Depot and ask for a soil conditioner.  At Home Depot, its called Water Saver or Nature's Helper or Clay buster.  All it is Pine Bark fines.  Also, the Miracle Grow for tree and shrubs is mostly pine bark fines too.  It pays to experiement.  I've played with a lot of different soils mixes.  Some say Cow manure and Mushroom compost is the same but it isn't.  Bill from Bill's figs uses pure mushroom compost for his trees.  Al's mix is great and trees grow well in it, but I can't use that stuff for my self watering pots.[/QUOTE]

Good points. In the North PBF are hard to find. I do find them occasionally in the forms you listed. I ordered mine from Agway but I had to get an entire pallet. However, that is the cheap part of the mix. I've been blending 50/50 with ProMix HP. I need to find a mix to make that part a little cheaper and of course still work.

[QUOTE=ADelmanto][QUOTE=snaglpus]If you're looking for pine bark fines, go to Lowes or Home Depot and ask for a soil conditioner.  At Home Depot, its called Water Saver or Nature's Helper or Clay buster.  All it is Pine Bark fines.  Also, the Miracle Grow for tree and shrubs is mostly pine bark fines too.  It pays to experiement.  I've played with a lot of different soils mixes.  Some say Cow manure and Mushroom compost is the same but it isn't.  Bill from Bill's figs uses pure mushroom compost for his trees.  Al's mix is great and trees grow well in it, but I can't use that stuff for my self watering pots.[/QUOTE]

Good points. In the North PBF are hard to find. I do find them occasionally in the forms you listed. I ordered mine from Agway but I had to get an entire pallet. However, that is the cheap part of the mix. I've been blending 50/50 with ProMix HP. I need to find a mix to make that part a little cheaper and of course still work. [/QUOTE]

Most of these peat, pine bark mulch and perlite plus lime etc. recipes come in at around $2 cubic foot.

How many cubic ft are in one of those $35 bails of ProMix? It says 3.8 cu ft but it expands to ??? Let's say 8 cu ft that's $4.38/ cu ft. I cut that with equal amounts of PBF say $10 for 8 cu ft. So I'm at $45 for 16 cu ft. Or $2.81 cu ft. Plus lime and fert. Sound about right? I'm looking to cut that in half.

[QUOTE=ADelmanto]How many cubic ft are in one of those $35 bails of ProMix? It says 3.8 cu ft but it expands to ??? Let's say 8 cu ft that's $4.38/ cu ft. I cut that with equal amounts of PBF say $10 for 8 cu ft. So I'm at $45 for 16 cu ft. Or $2.81 cu ft. Plus lime and fert. Sound about right? I'm looking to cut that in half. [/QUOTE]

Some of the links I posted show ProMix is mostly peat so why not just use peat in your recipe?

The fig pictures I have in my Propagation thread were all grown in approx. 90% MG + 10% perlite.

Rich, which MG do you use.  It obviously works from the results you have posted.  Thanks.

[QUOTE=dirtguy50]Rich, which MG do you use.  It obviously works from the results you have posted.  Thanks.[/QUOTE]

MG Potting Mix - not the moisture control version

[QUOTE=ADelmanto]How many cubic ft are in one of those $35 bails of ProMix? It says 3.8 cu ft but it expands to ??? Let's say 8 cu ft that's $4.38/ cu ft. I cut that with equal amounts of PBF say $10 for 8 cu ft. So I'm at $45 for 16 cu ft. Or $2.81 cu ft. Plus lime and fert. Sound about right? I'm looking to cut that in half. [/QUOTE] Oops Here it is http://www.pthorticulture.com/en/products/pro-mix-hp-mycorrhizae/#tab:product-specification

ADelmanto,
From an earlier topic on potting mix recipes, http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=6704202 , I posted the following...

Fertilome UPM: 85% - 15% (peat - perlite).
Pro-Mix BX:       85% - 15% (peat - perlite).
Pro-Mix HP:      75% - 25% (peat - perlite).
Fafard52:         60% - 30% - 10% (pinebark - peat - perlite)
5-1-1:              71.4% - 14.3% - 14.3% (pine bark - peat - perlite).
5-1-1-1:           62.5% - 12.5% - 12.5% - -12.5% (pine bark - peat - perlite - Oil Absorbent)

And
[QUOTE]Originally posted by leon_edmond
For a number of years I used the old Ray Givan potting mix recipe consisting of:
2 parts fine pine bark
1 part perlite
1 part composted manure
Depending on conditions, adding more pine bark or composted manure adjusts for either a more porous vs. water retentive mix.
To this I would dust with dolomitic lime and osmocote.
I got tired of mixing my own potting soil and now I purchase a ready mix nursery blend from a local supplier that is cheaper and works just as well.[/QUOTE]

IMO, if you plan on using composted manure it should be equivalent to the "Peat" (fine / high porosity / high water retention) portion and the "Peat" portion should never exceed 50% of the total mix for a standard top watered container. For a bottom watered (SIP) over 60% "Peat" portion is necessary for proper wicking.

[QUOTE=RichinNJ][QUOTE=dirtguy50]Rich, which MG do you use.  It obviously works from the results you have posted.  Thanks.[/QUOTE] MG Potting Mix - not the moisture control version[/QUOTE]

Got it.  Thanks.

[QUOTE=ascpete]ADelmanto,
From an earlier topic on potting mix recipes, http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=6704202 , I posted the following...

Fertilome UPM: 85% - 15% (peat - perlite).
Pro-Mix BX:       85% - 15% (peat - perlite).
Pro-Mix HP:      75% - 25% (peat - perlite).
Fafard52:         60% - 30% - 10% (pinebark - peat - perlite)
5-1-1:              71.4% - 14.3% - 14.3% (pine bark - peat - perlite).
5-1-1-1:           62.5% - 12.5% - 12.5% - -12.5% (pine bark - peat - perlite - Oil Absorbent)

And
[QUOTE]Originally posted by leon_edmond
For a number of years I used the old Ray Givan potting mix recipe consisting of:
2 parts fine pine bark
1 part perlite
1 part composted manure
Depending on conditions, adding more pine bark or composted manure adjusts for either a more porous vs. water retentive mix.
To this I would dust with dolomitic lime and osmocote.
I got tired of mixing my own potting soil and now I purchase a ready mix nursery blend from a local supplier that is cheaper and works just as well.[/QUOTE]

IMO, if you plan on using composted manure it should be equivalent to the "Peat" (fine / high porosity / high water retention) portion and the "Peat" portion should never exceed 50% of the total mix for a standard top watered container. For a bottom watered (SIP) over 60% "Peat" portion is necessary for proper wicking.[/QUOTE]

I dunno Pete .. Not sure where the 50% came from. Any data to support that ?
MG is > than 60 % peat and I've had good results with it.

Rich,
As I stated above, its my opinion. Its based on growing out hundreds of cuttings in dozens of different potting mixes and ratios and also reading through past posts here and at GardenWeb on potting mix recipes .

BTW if weight is not an issue, 5- 10 gallon containers, washed Pea Gravel makes a great substitute for Perlite.

[QUOTE=ascpete]....BTW if weight is not an issue, 5- 10 gallon containers, washed Pea Gravel makes a great substitute for Perlite.[/QUOTE]

I completely disagree .. Not anywhere close to being the same.

Rich,
The Pea Gravel serves a similar function as coarse Perlite at a fraction of the cost... it increase aeration, but will not degrade and will not float to the top. It only adds a few pounds to a 5 or 10 gallon container (only 13% of the mix) and locally I can get Pea Gravel delivered at a cost of ~ $20.00 per Cubic Yard

Another earlier topic on mix recipes... http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/consensus-on-potting-mix-6416224?&trail=50

BTW, I have used the Agway Pine Bark Mulch for the past 3 years and have sifted it on occasion through 1/2" - 1/4" to 1/8" mesh. the ratio of coarse to fine(dust) is usually about 4 to 1, so the 5-1-1 mix is really approximately a 4-2-1 ratio in particle size when using the Agway Pine Bark Mulch.