Banned members

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Hershell

Registered:1396922438
Posts: 650

Posted 1423583369	Reply with quote #1

Wills and Ampersand are no longer here. What the heck. No one will miss the others. If your banned for the good that you do and trying to keep the foolishness of others to a minimum, why bother? __________________ Hershell Zone 8. Ray City, Ga.

figpig_66

Registered:1416870358
Posts: 2,678

Posted 1423583536	Reply with quote #2

Wills banned and ampersand __________________ RICHIE BONI HICKORY LOUISIANA ZONE 8B WARM HUMID WINRERS ARE VERY MILD LOW 20'S BUT WARMS RIGHT UP DURING THE DAY. SUMMER IS EXTREMELY HOT & HUMID 100 degrees 100% humidity fig tree grow like crazy but some split from rain & humidity Wish list. Col de dame blanc Col de rimada Lsu numbered figs

strudeldog

Registered:1278124225
Posts: 747

Posted 1423584942 · Edited	Reply with quote #3

I am sorry to hear Kelby and Wills are effected, hopefully just a probation. I am surprised as I never saw them use vulgar statements or profanity here only confront the ignorance and bad manners of the undesirables. It is always the loser of a discussion that turns to vulgarity and profanity on a public forum, those that don’t have the intellect or self control to express themselves. Maybe if folks express their thoughts here it will be considered members can be re-established if they desire. Maybe some other good folks would consider participating again in the forum as well that have left. If you find redeeming qualities of a couple others that I hear were removed as well, support them here if you choose. You will find no support from me personally of at least a couple members re-joining here but that's just my insignificant thoughts. __________________ Phil N.GA. Zone 7 Looking for: De La Reina, Del La Senyora, Martinenca Rimada, Parfum De Cafards, Ponte Tresa, Sangue Dulce, Emalyn's Purple, and on and on

Hershell

Registered:1396922438
Posts: 650

Posted 1423585376 · Edited	Reply with quote #4

Overwhelmingly the comunity was united and two stood alone in my oppenion. I tried to avoid them at all cost and then the ones that did try to contribute in meaningful ways were banned. It would be great to show your support here if you choose to. Too many have chose to leave because of a few. I know decisions are tough to make on who to remove but it is necessary at times. Who am I to disagree. I guess the other forums don't look so bad after all. __________________ Hershell Zone 8. Ray City, Ga.

ako1974

Registered:1393356294
Posts: 299

Posted 1423585856	Reply with quote #5

How can you tell who got banned - through personal communication? Or can you search for that? __________________ Arne Zone 6a - NJ

FigaroNewton

Registered:1403556278
Posts: 75

Posted 1423586088	Reply with quote #6

I too hope Jon treats Kelby and Wills absence as a suspension (a very short one). It is my opinion that the wheat was tossed out with the chaff in this instance. regards, billy __________________ Billy - Middle Tennessee Seeking: C'hiapetta, A'driatic JH, and S'mith maybe 2 cuttings or so of each. Thank-you.

figgary

Registered:1387147322
Posts: 833

Posted 1423586253	Reply with quote #7

Good question, Arne. I would be VERY disappointed to learn that WillsC and Ampersand had actually been banned. __________________ Gary in CA 9A Seeking: Bebera Branca*, Colonel Littman's Cross

Hershell

Registered:1396922438
Posts: 650

Posted 1423586302	Reply with quote #8

Look at the members names in the search __________________ Hershell Zone 8. Ray City, Ga.

waynea

Registered:1362316304
Posts: 1,886

Posted 1423586763	Reply with quote #9

It doesn't sound right, I'm missing something, I checked both profiles and everything looks normal. Surely this is a mistake to ban them and Jon let's someone that makes downright vulgar statements that no member should be subject to, especially children and women. to have full reins of the forum. Oh well, I guess stranger things have happened. I think it's just a mistake, I think Jon is above something like this. This is a good forum.

zone5figger

Registered:1395082963
Posts: 250

Posted 1423587963	Reply with quote #10

I add my voice to the growing chorus calling for the un-banning of Wills and Ampersand(Kelby). __________________ Jesse- zone 5, 1000' elevation

greenfig

Registered:1359790036
Posts: 3,182

Posted 1423588066	Reply with quote #11

Anybody else was banned? __________________ wish list: Violeta, Calderona. USDA z 10a, SoCal

DesertDance

Registered:1247674606
Posts: 4,518

Posted 1423588232	Reply with quote #12

Jon is the moderator of this site and has the right to ban any member who attacks another publicly. Against forum rules. The banning may be temporary, but Jon is like Santa. He knows who's been good and who has not. Let's forget about this now and talk figs please? Suzi __________________ Zone 9b, Southern California. "First year they sleep, Second year they creep, Third year they leap!" Wish List: I wish all of you happy fig collecting! My wishes have been fulfilled!

Hershell

Registered:1396922438
Posts: 650

Posted 1423588525	Reply with quote #13

Yes. The two trouble makers apparently were banned. __________________ Hershell Zone 8. Ray City, Ga.

Figaro

Registered:1360799941
Posts: 436

Posted 1423588748 · Edited	Reply with quote #14

I have to agree, Hershell. WillsC is a great guy and has always been extremely helpful and generous to the forum. It seems the only mistake he made was standing up to a bully he probably should have just ignored. I don't understand the moderator's decisions on these issues since it seems he let's the problem remain while banning the members who point out the problem. __________________ ============================ [B]Figaro Zone 10b - South Florida[/I] Growing: Black Mission, Strawberry Verte, LSU Hollier, LSU Purple, LSU Scotts Black, Cajun Gold, Panachee, Excel, UCR 291-4, UCR 143-36, Violette de Bordeaux, Ronde de Bordeaux, Calvert, Black Madeira, Col De Dame Blanc Wish List: CdDN, CdDG, Ischia Black, Galicia Negra ============================

figpig_66

Registered:1416870358
Posts: 2,678

Posted 1423588881 · Edited	Reply with quote #15

Just read that kelby and wills are added back. __________________ RICHIE BONI HICKORY LOUISIANA ZONE 8B WARM HUMID WINRERS ARE VERY MILD LOW 20'S BUT WARMS RIGHT UP DURING THE DAY. SUMMER IS EXTREMELY HOT & HUMID 100 degrees 100% humidity fig tree grow like crazy but some split from rain & humidity Wish list. Col de dame blanc Col de rimada Lsu numbered figs

greenfig

Registered:1359790036
Posts: 3,182

Posted 1423589015	Reply with quote #16

Quote: Originally Posted by figpig_66 Just read that kelby and wills are added back. How do you guys figure this out?? __________________ wish list: Violeta, Calderona. USDA z 10a, SoCal

figpig_66

Registered:1416870358
Posts: 2,678

Posted 1423589165	Reply with quote #17

Was posted on another forum i just checked member list. I didnt see wills. But not good i seaching members. I mosly read post for info __________________ RICHIE BONI HICKORY LOUISIANA ZONE 8B WARM HUMID WINRERS ARE VERY MILD LOW 20'S BUT WARMS RIGHT UP DURING THE DAY. SUMMER IS EXTREMELY HOT & HUMID 100 degrees 100% humidity fig tree grow like crazy but some split from rain & humidity Wish list. Col de dame blanc Col de rimada Lsu numbered figs

mgginva

Registered:1320266925
Posts: 1,855

Posted 1423589473	Reply with quote #18

Geeeez - what happened? If my vote counts I throw it into the camp supporting WillsC and Kelby who are both great guys and positive members of this forum. These guys are not trouble makers. Please let them come back. thx, mgg __________________ Michael in Virginia (zone 7a) Wish list: Perretta,

drivewayfarmer

Registered:1260287641
Posts: 773

Posted 1423589857	Reply with quote #19

Looking forward to the return of Wills and Kelby. __________________ Kerry Zone 5 NH Wish list :Galicia Negra , Col de Dame Blanca/Negra .

andreas

Registered:1401724296
Posts: 372

Posted 1423590078	Reply with quote #20

they are not back... they cant log in!!! that is so sad. __________________ andreas-patras Patra Peloponnisos Greece zone..9a

hllyhll

Registered:1358637509
Posts: 162

Posted 1423591348	Reply with quote #21

Quote: Originally Posted by drivewayfarmer Looking forward to the return of Wills and Kelby. Exactly. __________________ Tony WV 6b

FMD

Registered:1309800590
Posts: 1,327

Posted 1423591452	Reply with quote #22

If the ban on Wills and Kelby hold, it will be a turning point for me on this forum. And others as well. __________________ Frank Tallahassee, FL Zone 8b North Florida Figs

ascpete

Registered:1336096379
Posts: 1,942

Posted 1423592921	Reply with quote #23

I acknowledge that Jon V. has the right and responsibility to ban members and delete topics that devolve into vulgarity and name calling, he is the administrator, but continually deleting entire Topics doesn't address the root cause of this argument. Placing Known cultivar names on unknown or found figs only serves to diminish the Hobby by placing inferior and untried cultivars in circulation as known and true cultivars. Its a good argument with a simple solution, one that Jon V uses in his Varieties Database. I'm with Frank (FMD).... BTW, I've read the deleted topic and saved a PDF copy, which is not currently relevant to this discussion.

JLee

Registered:1418921816
Posts: 66

Posted 1423593165	Reply with quote #24

I never worked with Kelby, but Wills has been great. I would kindly request the ban be removed as well. __________________ Orange County, California / Zone 10b Wish List: Col de Dame Grise, Aubique Petite, Vasilika Sika, Galicia Negra -Jeffrey and Anna

strudeldog

Registered:1278124225
Posts: 747

Posted 1423593231 · Edited	Reply with quote #25

ascpete, Good to see you post. Welcome back. I never have communicated direct with you, but always enjoyed the info you placed out there. It is obvious that that you put a lot of thought into fig culture. It upset me when it seemed like an undesirable discouraged you from the forum. __________________ Phil N.GA. Zone 7 Looking for: De La Reina, Del La Senyora, Martinenca Rimada, Parfum De Cafards, Ponte Tresa, Sangue Dulce, Emalyn's Purple, and on and on

penandpike

Registered:1299713708
Posts: 129

Posted 1423593779	Reply with quote #26

I can not belive that those that stand to confront this AROGANT PUNK Aa... got baned. This is just not right and I won't be around here for long if this is true. __________________ Pen Europe, Bulgaria, Zone-6a

ascpete

Registered:1336096379
Posts: 1,942

Posted 1423593817	Reply with quote #27

Phil (Strudeldog), Thanks. I'm not back, as a vacationing forum member I just had to post my support for the banned members. It would be great if we could have constructive discourse without name calling and trolling.

needaclone

Registered:1346812939
Posts: 604

Posted 1423594385	Reply with quote #28

I missed whatever might have been posted last night, but I read a certain contentious thread or two during the day yesterday. Unless I missed some late posts that totally changed the game, I would say that banning Wills and Kelby (and ONLY Wills and Kelby) was not the move I would have made in this situation. An aggressive defense is not the same as an unprovoked attack. And many of the heated disagreements I've seen over the last few months were based on a sense of protecting/informing folks (noobies or otherwise) from misinformation...i.e. for the good of the forum as a whole. The thing I always loved about this forum was that it was NOT like other forums. That has become less and less true as the days go by. (Pete, good to see you posting again, even if it doesn't last long...) Jim __________________ Clarksburg, NJ - Zone 6b Wishlist - A wise man recommended: Nero600M . Malta Black . Tacoma (Takoma) Violet . Gino's . Adriatic JH . Vista Mission . Florea . Atreano . ...also...RdB, Bethlehem Black, Negronne, Grise de St. Jean, Livano, Col de Dame Blanc/Gris/Noir, Vasilika Sika, Longue D'Aout, Italian 258, Pennsylvania 6-5000

Posturedoc

Registered:1201308628
Posts: 159

Posted 1423595026 · Edited	Reply with quote #29

For many of the reasons already provided on this thread, I strongly urge Jon to unban, take out of timeout or otherwise reinstate Wills and Kelby to the forum. Conversely, and this comes from a somebody who generally follows a live and let live philosophy, I would not be upset if the other two who were removed are not invited back. One is at the center of, is, in fact, the cause of repeated forum upsets and the other sews discord whenever he sees an opportunity. They, more than any other members, make what was once a warm and inviting environment a much less hospitable place. __________________ Neil Reno, NV Zone 6b

fitzski

Registered:1418923211
Posts: 79

Posted 1423595229	Reply with quote #30

As a newbie, I'd like to voice my support for WillsC and Ampersand(Kelby). I have learned not only from their recent posts but their past posts. I have read Kelby's thread on Cold Hardy Figs many times. I hope it's only a temporary suspension vs a permanent ban. __________________ Kevin Zone 5b/6a(Eastern MA)

indestructible87

Registered:1368407095
Posts: 548

Posted 1423595462	Reply with quote #31

Kelby and wills are two of the nicest people on here that I've had interactions with. But when pushed I'm sure that they push back. Golden rule folks... __________________ Travis Pittsburgh, PA

rafaelissimmo

Registered:1335639347
Posts: 1,473

Posted 1423595915 · Edited	Reply with quote #32

Here's a wakeup call to every member of the forum: if you stand up, even politely, against perceived injustice, your account might be deleted without notice or explanation. So all of us need to be careful how we mix it up here. Kelby was unfailingly polite in his comments, and against severe provocation. Perhaps it was imprudent of him to post a PM, but I for one will miss him. Good to see Pete again. __________________ Zone 7b, Queens, New York

HarveyC

Registered:1212433117
Posts: 3,294

Posted 1423596224	Reply with quote #33

I have lots of thoughts on this but will just write Jon personally. I learned to walk away from fights a long time ago because I very well might have killed someone if I didn't because of a bad temper. Heck, I walked away from a boss 30 years ago and he told me to come back and I told him if I did I was going to take his head off. I know some folks would have wished I didn't walk away.... __________________ Harvey - Correia Farms Isleton, CA (Sacramento County) USDA zone 9b, Sunset zone 14 http://www.figaholics.com https://www.facebook.com/Figaholics

bigfig

Registered:1417908022
Posts: 87

Posted 1423596294	Reply with quote #34

NOT WillsC ,,,,,,,,WILL is a great guy and has always helped me, he gave my plenty of helpful info .also very generous on his cuttings .someone tell me this is a bad dream __________________ Wish list :vasilika sika,,JH Adriaticand common french Joe New Jersey 6a

paully22

Registered:1195324538
Posts: 2,719

Posted 1423596369	Reply with quote #35

Looks like I missed everything. Who else were banned ? I hope it was a suspension for Wills and Kelby.

strudeldog

Registered:1278124225
Posts: 747

Posted 1423599187 · Edited	Reply with quote #36

Just to clarify as there are multiple Aaron and Rich. Aaron4USA RichinNJ are the accounts as well we believe are effected, and who I reference as undesirables. __________________ Phil N.GA. Zone 7 Looking for: De La Reina, Del La Senyora, Martinenca Rimada, Parfum De Cafards, Ponte Tresa, Sangue Dulce, Emalyn's Purple, and on and on

snaglpus

Registered:1244258188
Posts: 4,072

Posted 1423599718	Reply with quote #37

HOW BOUT THOSE FIG???????? __________________ Dennis Charlotte, North Carolina/Zone 8a

shah8

Registered:1339623766
Posts: 657

Posted 1423599972	Reply with quote #38

I don't put up with stupidity and I have always simply ignored people like the Aaron who I believe must have been at fault. If I didn't understand how forum moderators tend to have other things they need to do, I'd have been surprised at how long Aaron lasted. A very toxic enthusiasm... That said, I don't know about Kelby, but WillsC seems to have been a productive commentator. If the behavior wasn't that bad, I would welcome him back. That said, there is too much nutbar behavior from people who have dollar signs for eyes. Or petty pride, which is just as bad, particularly when it's not boasting about the best tree in a neighborhood or technique for some specific need--in a globally connected and hugely complex world. Figs just aren't very important, and all of us hobbyist and UPick farmers are just here to do something we desire to do. It should be fun. __________________ Especially desired figs: UCD 187-25, UCD 200-48, UCD 157-17, UCD 309-B1, Princesa, Black Madeira, high quality sugar fig that ripens Sept-Oct. Probable desired fig: Smith, St Jean, JH Adriatic, CddB, Gulbun, Pastilliere, Sucrette Rooting: Smith, CDDB--this pretty much means I have my fun tries (tho' important since they are truly desirable), and only interested for this year: Gulbun, BM, 187-25, or something wildly exotic or precious that nobody has any good reason to send me.

OttawanZ5

Registered:1192897779
Posts: 2,551

Posted 1423603784	Reply with quote #39

I believe Jon waited long enough hoping the clash of egos will end because most members are mature (albeit with varying sizes of egos). Many time it started as a reaction to "I, my, me" attitude apparent in some posts then followed by pushback by others who also ignored the interest of other members that is not to escalate the duels but better dampen it down. The clashes did not end. So, Jon had to take action. It will be naive to think that it was not expected coming. It could have been expected within +/- an hour or two (literally)! Jon has life beside the Fig4Fun. Fig4Fun is not for-a-profit organization but in a way a service to the fig hobby community. He can't be expected to monitor minute by minute, and some do appreciate Jon's patient way of dealing with such situation hoping patience will prevail but everything has a limit. Forum has been graciously made available and maintained by Jon for the hobby happiness of all. Jon has avoided rush reactions. He finally felt the limit has been reached and breached and so he acted. He must have weighed the situation our time and banned the people who in his view acted-or-reacted outside the expected norms and eventually banned them. I believe Jon has earned the privilege to have room when and how to take action. He also has the good of the forum at his heart. Giving him feedback is one thing but putting undue pressure on him can be problematic. What can legally prevent him to switch the F4F off in disgust. We try to login one day and the Forum is not available. Yes, some may not care but many do care and enjoy it and wish to continue in a good atmosphere for all. Occasional misunderstanding can be cleared in decent ways. I agree that he ban should not be permanent. A forced first sabbatical for (n to 6 ) months may be expected to serve the purpose. If the undesired attitude is resumed by the member then longer ban. It is not the first time that egos clashes happened here. It happened before some years ago. Fortunately, the Forum stayed quiet when some with big egos left but after causing some good members to leave in disgust. Let us hope normalcy returns and stays. It is just my opinion. __________________ Ottawan-Z5a, Canada

m5allen

Registered:1378496146
Posts: 153

Posted 1423604375	Reply with quote #40

Dang. Wills is my gardening mentor, he got me started with blueberries and then on figs. He is not too far from me, so I have been to his place a few times. That is a shame. __________________ -Mike Tampa, FL Zone 9b. Growing: Black Madeira, CDDG, Malta Black, VDB, Petite Negra, LSU Purple, Celeste, Battaglia, Alma and Grasa's Unknown Seattle Purple

dirtguy50

Registered:1398135169
Posts: 256

Posted 1423605959 · Edited	Reply with quote #41

I don't have a comment either way but wanted to be clear. Did all four of them get banned? Kelby, WillC, Aaron4USA, and RichinNJ? __________________ No, your other left! Zone 6b, Keith in SW Wish List: Violette de Bordeaux & Marsilles Black VS

FiggyFrank

Registered:1347560723
Posts: 2,712

Posted 1423606491	Reply with quote #42

I'd also like to see Kelby and Wills back. Really good guys. __________________ Frank zone 7a - VA

eboone

Registered:1378418906
Posts: 1,100

Posted 1423607622	Reply with quote #43

I respect Jon's right to make his own decisions for what he feels is the good of the forum. But I would appreciate some word on what he has decided to do with this mess and with these folks, and I suspect that many of the others posting in this thread would also. __________________ Ed Zone 6A - Southwest PA --------------------------- Short wish list: CDDG, LSU Red, Dark Greek (Navid), Col Littman's Black Cross. And any cold hardy early fig.

adoresfigs45

Registered:1421515059
Posts: 254

Posted 1423612412	Reply with quote #44

Hmm, I guess I missed it all. I have bought material from Wills and Kelby always seemed nice. I thought this was a place where I can learn about figs from people who have ideas and facts and just plain ole in depth knowledge and experience that would make me a better figger rather than a muncher. As some have said, there is always a second chance. It is kinda like your puppy: mostly good and loveable with big feet that stumble and make mistakes that can be forgiven. You don't throw him out the door in the snow. I would like to see them back if they will come. Just a newbie weighing in. Can't we all dig in the dirt together :)

DesertDance

Registered:1247674606
Posts: 4,518

Posted 1423613493	Reply with quote #45

adoresfigs45. Been her longer than most. Here is the history. This was a fig only place until a few newbies with egos wanted to take over. All hell broke out. MEN! They don't do well with that. Huge cyber fights started. The real figgers just cringed. That would be me. But our leader, Jon, figured out the problem and banned a few for a while. Don't think it's permanent. Just meant to teach a lesson. Sort of like the California 3 strikes rule. They have been warned. Still doing it. Now on suspension. do it again? Banned forever!! Suzi __________________ Zone 9b, Southern California. "First year they sleep, Second year they creep, Third year they leap!" Wish List: I wish all of you happy fig collecting! My wishes have been fulfilled!

waynea

Registered:1362316304
Posts: 1,886

Posted 1423613782	Reply with quote #46

Thanks Suzi, I was worried for a while, I am glad that you know what Jon is doing and informed us. Thanks again.

GregMartin

Registered:1370378358
Posts: 550

Posted 1423614376	Reply with quote #47

Jon, can we have our Wills and Kelby back....please? They're both very productive and helpful members. __________________ zone 5 Maine Seeking: Saint Martin, Naples White, Black Tuscan, Bécane, French Alps, Abruzzi, Tenica, Wild Mountain Figs from the coldest corners (Iranian, Turkish or other...would love seeds too)

deerhunter16b

Registered:1352062719
Posts: 785

Posted 1423616437	Reply with quote #48

Quote: Originally Posted by GregMartin Jon, can we have our Wills and Kelby back....please? They're both very productive and helpful members. I agree 100% __________________ john Zone 7a

DesertDance

Registered:1247674606
Posts: 4,518

Posted 1423617422	Reply with quote #49

Let me ask you a question. Would you like a private message you sent put public? I doubt it. This is what started the drama. This is why the boys are sitting on stools and on time out. Can you picture them? They watch, but they cant say a word. They are all little bad boys. Time out. Jon is dad. He decides when the time out is over, and they better behave! Suzi __________________ Zone 9b, Southern California. "First year they sleep, Second year they creep, Third year they leap!" Wish List: I wish all of you happy fig collecting! My wishes have been fulfilled!

dirtguy50

Registered:1398135169
Posts: 256

Posted 1423620116 · Edited	Reply with quote #50

I am trying to follow this issue and asked this about 3-4 hours ago, so who all is banned? (Hopefully temporarily like Lisa articulated). I am hopeful some of these responses are based on fact and not knee-gerk emotions. Just asking. __________________ No, your other left! Zone 6b, Keith in SW Wish List: Violette de Bordeaux & Marsilles Black VS

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