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Coll de Dame varieties

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Originally Posted by DevIsgro
Thanks for the clarification Harvey! This business of genetically testing figs is fascinating.


This report has been discussed here several times in the past.  Since it is based on testing that didn't test all genes or genes which were identified as representing specific species characteristics it is clear that this report is more useful in identifying which varieties are different from one another than which ones are the same.  In other words, if some genes were found to be different, than those accessions are obviously different.  However, if two accessions show that the tested genes are the same there is still a significant chance that other genes not tested are different.  There's been prior discussion about Sal's, Dark No. 1 Portuguese, and Abruzzi not being the same even though they appear to be on the chart in this report.  It's a useful report but the limitations need to be understood.  Since the time this study was done additional work on understanding the Ficus carica genome has been done in Japan and Israel, the last I checked (I actually had a geneticist friend of mine read the information at genbank.org for me since I did not understand what I was looking at).
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Originally Posted by Stormy

To SAS and all others,
I start to think my reply is a bit off-topic. Confident about the true nature of this fig, my lovely wife bought it in a respected nursery about three years ago, I never asked myself if this could be a different type, until I joined this forum, silly me...:)
When we stopped by the same nursery just yesterday, I was struck by the sheer disorder in the different types of figs that they offer.
That's why I asked my wife to go back three years in time and try to remember where she picked it from. Now, at the time she came back home with just a picked fig, to let me taste it. The whole idea was if I would like it, then she would buy a tree from the same kind. I did like it, so about two weeks later, she picks up the tree, which she believes is a CDD, and brings it back home.
Since I still liked the figs that come off it, I am not displeased off course, but still, wanting to know the real type of fig I am eating has becoming a bit of a challenge actually.
And, I think I have found it on Calgoni. Now here are the pics from my alleged CDD.


3079155.jpg  3079157.jpg 



Hi Stormy,
First of all I don't think you are off-topic however you'd be better off emailing baud with your pictures as people here are too busy figuring out what they got with their formulated arguments .Meanwhile you are in a better position to get all the true to type CDD's. I agree with you and I believe your fig is cendorsa.

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Baud will tell me, for sure! Or at least tell me it's not a CDD. Thanks
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Originally Posted by alanmercieca
Exactly, and there is a chance they still do not understand ficus DNA well enough for the DNA testing to be trusted.


I would 100% disagree with that. The process is extremely reliable. Interpretation can differ, sure, but the actually reading of the genes by a genetic lab are extremely reliable. Some people are spending 20 years in prison over it, and to say they may be wrong, well i would ask what makes you think it could be wrong? You don't like extraction methods? Or what is it that makes you think it is wrong? The fact we don't know what the genes actually do has nothing to do with their order, or what that order is. The difference between ficus DNA and human DNA is order of the DNA amino acids. The DNA of all living things is exactly the same 4 amino acids. We all speak English, why GMO's are possible. Our bodies could read fig genes no problem if inserted. It is a little more complex but not that much. We have found ways to determine where genes start, and where they stop in DNA sequences, it is complex, but I trust the result 100%. We have been doing this for over 50 years now.
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Fascinating stuff! Thanks for the details and the report, Harvey!
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Hi drew51,
You should read more on DNA testing. Don't trust or misinterpret everything you read.
The problem is you may think that the labs do compare each and every single gene, WHERE THEY DON'T . That is a common misunderstanding !
There are way too more genes in cells to do that.
Instead they choose some genes called "Markers". Those markers are "sort of" known to vary enough in between people or in between the trees that are tested - so they are chosen arbitrarily to be significant.
So they don't test the whole genes but just a tiny subset.
In your own body, all cells don't have all the same genes. Thus you have 2 arms and 2 legs, and not 4 arms or 4 legs :) .
So testing the whole genes in between cells is nevertheless irrelevant .
So in that tiny subset, you could find 2 creatures having those in common, despite not being the same or not being in the same family - that's where the choice of the markers is important and should be relevant.

Some years ago I got shocked . I saw a picture of a cloned cat and others of cloned cattle ... The stains on their coats where not even the same ... How are they supposed to be clones, sharing the same all genes, when their skin is not even a match.
Well they are clones in regards to the tested tiny set ... stains on the skin not being part of the set ...
Have a good day !
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When I was getting my economics degree we ran data regressions, it was the same thing. You had to have the right data and right variables chosen or your data regression was crap. Otherwise you could get info of varying usefulness.
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Originally Posted by Sas
In the French language Le Col is used as a masculine and not La Col as a feminin name. Therefore when calling the color of those figs, you are referring to le Col. The names would be Gris, Blanc or Noir without the (e) at the end. You don't say Col de Dame Blanche. The same name is used in Spanish as Col de Signora. Roja would be similar to Gris. I am currently growing all three in ground and so far the most productive is the Blanc (UCD).The most vigorous grower is the Gris. I agree with Blue that the Blanc (UCD) is currently my preferred of all three and perhaps of my entire collection. There's another version of Blanc (Baud) that I'm finding to be hard to get to produce in pots. My observation far is that this variety (any Color) needs several years before you get good results and needs lots of heat in order to ripen its fruit. It's a late variety.


Perfect explanation!

By the way, I am the "touchy french man"
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Originally Posted by alanmercieca
Human DNA is way better understood than ficus DNA, DNA testing is way more advanced for people than for figs.


I would 100% disagree with that, I work in a medical lab. We know very little about human DNA. We have all the alleles mapped out, but we have no idea what they do? Well some, maybe 5%.
You seem to totally miss the point in that their actually is no difference. If I gave you examples of Ficus DNA, and told you it was human, you would have no way to tell. 
You don't need to know anything about ficus DNA to determine if two trees are related. Same with humans btw.
We know how to read ALL DNA it really matters little where it is from. The exact same reading techniques are used for all DNA. Dinosaur or fig, it does not matter. I didn't want falsehoods posted. The study is extremely good.
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