Topics

Figs in Zone 4b

Last fall I inherited a 7-year old, neglected fig tree, a Petite Negra according to the nursery label buried deep among the roots. I severely pruned the roots and the deformed branches and repotted the tree. The plant has responded well with many new shoots and 53 figs. The figs are 28 mm in diameter or a little larger than a U.S, quarter coin. See the attached photos. The tree is now  about 24 inches tall and 36 inches wide.

Based on weather data for the past 30 years, daily highs  above 70°F could last till the beginning of the 3rd week in September but the tree will likely have to be brought indoor at night from around the end of the 1st week of September (<50°F ). Will it be enough time for these figs to ripen?

In this Forum there are statements about thinning figs to accelerate maturing.  Three related questions:

1.What percentage of figs should be eliminated?

2. When should it be done?

3. How much time would be gained?

As stated above I severely pruned the roots and the tree and that likely delayed the plant development this spring. Has anyone observed by how much time root pruning delays the spring growth?

I have 3 or 4 similar sized figs on each of  Malta Black (cuttings from Herman2), Chicago Hardy (gifted air layer from cjmach; many thanks)  and a Bisirri #3 (cutting from Bigbadbill).

Many thanks to all who can offer any advice. These may be the first figs to ripen in Minnesota (Zone 4b); so I am anxious to see them to mature.

Marcel

    Attached Images

  • Click image for larger version - Name: figs-r.jpg, Views: 48, Size: 262879
  • Click image for larger version - Name: P-N_figs-r.jpg, Views: 46, Size: 50239
  • Click image for larger version - Name: P-N_leaves-r.jpg, Views: 38, Size: 226161

Seems like you've done a great job.  I'd pinch the tips and remove any fruit smaller than a marble but leave the rest.  With the current coloration of the bigger figs, it seems like you should begin to get ripe figs within a week or so.

Many growers pinch branches after some amount of growth (e.g., 6-8 leaves) but the timing seems to depend on growing conditions.  The basic question is "Will new figs ripen here in the remaining time?"  If the answer is no, then pinch.  I have no idea how much time is saved, you just know that the tree shouldn't waste its energy on fruit that won't ripen.

From the look of the figs, I doubt that the root pruning hurt you.  Time lost initially was probably made up later.  Anyway if you have ripe figs in MN, it's hard to criticize anything.

Joe, many thanks for the advice. I shall have to wait and see and shuttle the plants in at night, if the fruit are still in need of heat and time.

Marcel

Some varieties after pinch 4-5 leaf produce bigger fruits (2-3 per short branch) which appear very fast after pinch. In my zone 5 even VDB (local clone) not early ripening variety gives plenty enough fruits from inground tree after such pinch.

Personally I'm not a big fan of pinching the terminal buds, rather pinch the smallest figs and hope you will have enough sun for the grown out figs to ripen fully.
In your area, most probably, figs have stopped to grow altogether, if you pinch the buds now it will set you back next spring. At least that's the experience I have.
@Serge, maybe your area comes close to a 5b but don't forget the Ukraine enjoys warm summers with lots of sunshine and temps in the 80's and I am not convinced LaFigue has the same.

@LaFigue, avoid temperatures under 52F as that may well spark the start of dormancy for certain types of figs. Bringing them in at night would avoid this I think, even if that may be challenging for you, just guessing off course.

I agree with stormy, I never pinch mine for fruit production and they all fruit just fine. I don't remove figs til October either. It sends them into dormancy in my experience. I want them to keep growing for the most part till October. With all other plants pinching just encourages branching and growth for sure. Like with sweet cherries you do not want to prune after August first else they may not harden off incorrectly and you will lose tips during the winter.
I have pinched plants early as I want them to develop scaffolds. As for those figs pinched and not pinched, no difference in fruit production for me.

My .02 is to remove any figlets smaller than a grape at this point. The plant will benefit by not expending energy on developing fruit which doesnt have a chance to ripen. Dabbing a wee bit of oil on the eyes of the figs 2-3 weeks before your anticipated first frost date can help them ripen before that deadline as well. Different varieties respond differently to pinching, in my experience Petite Negra and others in the Violette de Bordeaux family are quite prolific when it comes to setting fruit, so maybe not so necessary to pinch after 6 leaves. Other types certainly do benefit and in short season locations getting fruit to start forming asap can make all the difference in getting ripe fruit before the weather turns. I think you've got a great chance at enjoying some nice ones this year. I leave my potted figs outside until the weather goes below 25 F, and I was getting ripe fruit up to that point even though the average daytime temps were only in the 50s and 60s.

Greetings all,

I am generally encouraged by the comments received; I might have a good chance to eat some fresh figs!!!

@Serge Thank you; your climate is somewhat like mine. I have warmer and sunnier summers than Kiev and Lviv (from climate data that I have gathered). But you have warmer temperatures in March and October. You seem to have a bit of a longer growing season than I have. I shall pinch my plants earlier in the spring to get fruit setting sooner.

@Stormy Thanks. I shall definitely bring the plants with figs in for nights about 50°F (10°C). I stopped pinching all my fig trees a week ago so that new shoots will have a chance to develop fully before frost.

@Drew51 good advice; I don't plan to remove figs until the trees are dormant. Thank you Drew.

@Zone5figger Thanks Jesse. I started removing small figlets at the end of July, so now all the 50 figs on the Petite Negra are slightly larger than a quarter coin (US currency). I shall try this oil drop bit technique. Is it just a matter of putting a drop of oil on the eye or does one have to prick the eye of the fig such as with a tooth pick that has a drop of oil?

Cheers,
Marcel

I've talked with a couple folks who yank all the leaves off and they claim it works great. I have tried it on a few trees and it does seem to work but I am not saying anything about it as a method as my trials were 3 out of over 500 trees. Way to low of a data base to draw any conclusions.

Michael,

This technique of removing leaves on grapevines, peach, apricot, fig trees as well as tomatoe plants has a long history. For grapes it can improve % of antioxidants and the quality of the wine, as well as reduce fungal problems. In figs it is generally to allow more sun to reach the fruit and improve the coloration of the fruit. There is never mention of accelerating the maturing of the fruit, though.

Old French references on leaf removal (effeuillage) on fig trees can be found for 1874 in the French national journal of horticulture as well as the book "Les arbres fruitiers" by G.Ad. Bellair published in 1891.

I might try that on one of the branches to provide full sun to the figs on that branch.

Thanks for reminding me of that old technique, which I had forgotten.

Does Petite Negra produce brebas????

Cheers,
Marcel

Marcel,
Never is never a good word to use in nature as it is always the exception that makes the rule.
I appreciate your opinion and I'm sorry I don't have the time to hunt down more examples but in just five minutes I found something you claim does not exist.
Here's the link.

Michael,
Sorry, no offense meant. I should have indicated specifically that the old French literature on the technique of leaf removal that I am familiar with never mentioned the technique being used to accelerate the ripening of the fruit.

I am aware of mentions on this forum of pinching and oiling. However, I was not aware of the specific defoliation that you cite and the link you provided. In the video cited, it seems that one side of the tree was defoliated. Was there a significant difference in the number of figs maturing and the timing of ripening between the two sides?

Thank you again.
Marcel

The way I oil my figs (that sounds a bit funny!) in order to hasten ripening is to apply a small dab of extra virgin olive oil with a q-tip on the eye of the fig. Just enough to 'paint' that area. This was done to figs which were at the stagnant stage, and in just a few days they began to swell and then ripen fully abut 2 weeks after oil was applied. I do this in mid September as my average first frost date is Oct 1st. I do not bring my plants inside at all until the temps drop below 25 F, in fact last season they were outside when the temp dipped below 20 and there was no harm done. I also stop all nitrogenous fertilization so that there is no tender growth going into fall.

Jesse, thank you for your explanation of your oiling method and the general treatment of your plants in the fall. The oiling is different from what I know of the technique in France, as shown in the attached picture, where a pointed object (sharp feather, pointed stick, or sewing needle/pin) dipped in oil is actually inserted in the eye of the fig.

Various postings on fig forums state that, once ripe, the oiled figs have very poor taste. In France, authors who have mentioned the oiling technique have described the taste of the oiled figs as "slightly changed" but not as "bad". What is your taste experience with oiled figs of your varieties?

Again in various postings, it is advised to bring in plants having fruit yet to ripen when temps. dip down 50 ºF or so. Do you find that cooler night temperatures in mid-september have little effects on the ripening of your later figs?

My apologies for all these questions; your zone 5 conditions are likely very close to those in my zone 4b. and we are basically at the same elevation 930ft in my case. I do benefit from the "urban heat island" effect but perhaps you do as well.
Cheers,
Marcel

    Attached Images

  • Click image for larger version - Name: oiling with pin.jpg, Views: 12, Size: 72652

Not Jesse, but I add my 2 cent on ripening during cold period (late).
From my old varieties (10+) only 3 have ripened fruits (good taste) during really cold nights and days. These were - Randino, Dalmatie, VDB clone. All the rest fail to give main crop or taste was not good,few sugar...
Brunswick ripened tasty breba but main was too late and taste was awful in early October (cold nigths and days).

Happy to help Marcel.
Seems that in general, figs slow down ripening in cooler weather and the sugar will not be as intense as ones which ripen in the summers heat. I echo Serge's assessment of VDB, and a very similar variety in my stable, Large Negronne, produced fine jammy figs in cold autumn weather. In terms of the flavor of oil treated figs, I haven't done any side by side comparisons (and truthfully only have a couple years fruiting experience and a small sample size each year) but they tasted good to me, better than nothing for sure! This season I got my plants an early start in my hoophouse,and may also use that space in the fall to give an additional couple weeks to late ripening varieties. Last season I did no season extention on either end, and many varieties were not able to ripen on time.

Selecting early ripening maincrop varieties is an important factor for us in short season locations, so choose with that in mind. Florea, Improved Celeste, Malta Black, Ronde De Bordeaux are my earliest maincrop varieties, and as my signature suggests, I'm always looking for "the next one." If I can help you with some cuttings this fall, don't hesitate to ask, I will be pruning in late October-early November.

Hello Serge,

As the growing season gets closer to being over here (statistically we could have our first frost in 4 weeks), it is painfully obvious that my sight should be on growing varieties with a good brebas crop and varieties that ripen a main crop very early on. I see from the list of varieties you have or are looking for that you have reached the same conclusion. As per the thread in this forum your Randino is a nice and very desirable fig.

I hope your summer will extend for a few more weeks and let you have a lovely crop of figs.

Cheers,
Marcel

Jesse,

Your advices are right on! As prevously advised by some members when I joined the forum last year, I have obtained some early ripening varieties: Improved Celeste and Black Malta. My RDB cuttings leafed out but never rooted.

This fall I shall be looking for Florea, RDB and Longue d'Août and also for the varieties for good brebas crop. I have kept my eyes on postings of list of heavy brebas producers.

Many thanks for your offer of cuttings; I shall PM you later when the pruning season has come for you.

Cheers,
Marcel

Marcel --

For breba producers, your best bets might be (1) the English Brown Turkey group of common figs (e.g., Laradek, Sweet [Susser] George, Bayernfeige Violetta, Valleiry); (2) the Violette de Bordeaux group of common figs (e.g., VdB, Negronne, Nero 600M, Valle Negra); and the San Pedros (e.g., Desert King, Filacciano Bianco, Grantham's Royal).

In general, the common fig varieties that hold and ripen a significant number of brebas seem to have late main crops, which won't ripen in your zone.  So your cultural practices, especially pruning, will be different for (a) the early main crop varieties (e.g., Florea, RdB) and (b) the breba varieties (e.g., Laradek, VdB, DK). 

Hello Marcel,
My VDB (clone) gave very tasty breba, but few...
Also not best for in ground as wood is a bit tender for winter survival.
Mid ripening variety, not early for sure.
Not sure if I can recommend this for 4 (5)zone as best choice (in ground, no green house).
It is very good, but good for south (6-7-8-9... Zones). In 6a (South of Ukraine) it is also reported to be tender for winterizing.

To my opinion (from 2009 in ground tests) for that far north should be only heavy reliable breba producers, earliest main crop ones and early main but which gives figs fast after pinch (4-5 leaf).
Otherwise it is just game of big bonsai :):)

@jrdewhirst: Thanks Joe. I have been scanning the postings to prepare a list of good producers of brebas in preparation for later during the cuttings offerings.

@Serge: Thank you Serge for your advice. And NO I am not interested in figs for bonsai (the leaves are too large!!!). My wife has already over 50 bonsai trees of various genera. In my area it would be impossible to keep fig trees in the ground without extreme efforts of winter protection as frost reaches down to 1 to 1.25m (40-50 in). A little further north in Minnesota frost reaches down to 2 meters (8 feet).

Today, in town was the Greek Festival. Much greek food was available but NO FIGS!!

Cheers,
Marcel

Reply Cancel
Subscribe Share Cancel