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Encanto Farms Nursery > Topics > Is this smyrna or common? (With few preliminary clues)
 
 


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persianmd2orchard

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Posted Reply with quote  #1 
Anyone have a guess if this is smyrna?

Clue 1: My Shiraz Green put on a breba figlet on rooting scion. I knocked it off after a week. I thought smyrnas don't put on breba.
Clue 2: Fruit size is reportedly small. I didn't think smyrna figs are usually small.
Clue 3: Horticulture journal articles report what sounds like the same variant--and call it indeed a smyrna(!)
Clue 4: origin of fig is in mountains near Shiraz, southern Fars Province of Iran

Any experts at determining smyrna or not based on limited prelim clues?
persianmd2orchard

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Posted Reply with quote  #2 
Follow up question--in the wild in the middle east mountains, if you don't hang up caprifigs... but there are nearby caprifig plants to a smyrna and wasp present--you can and do get wild pollination with no human manipulation, correct?????
lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #3 
Hi Persian,

Let me try and respond to your queries...

1- Many Smyrna varieties develop fig lets which given the timing they show up, look like brebas! but they do not last long on the tree and very early dry and fall. If by any means one reaches a state of fruition it will be an accident. A rare exception to the rule..

2- Big or small .. Smyrna's are like all other figs, some bigger than other...Until mid season without any particular treatment you get the bigger fruit, then they start being smaller and smaller.
This is to say that they are not always big figs.

3- Here I cannot comment... but even on credited  Journals sometimes we read strange statements

4- Your statement  suggests that these figs are from the 'WILD'    .Being so there will be strong possibilities that they were born from fertile seeds (naturally pollinated) and propagated by some creature.
this indicate that wasps are around the area.

Note on your following thread :

.. With live caprifigs around and/or mixed up with Smyrna fig trees,  wasps will definitely find the female trees get to them and achieve, in most cases, 100% pollination without any human presence or manipulation.

At the time we write this, NOW! wasps are starting to perform their great JOB,,, -every year by mid June.

I believe having seen pictures from you (?) on earlier threads showing dried Shiraz figs.
Make a test, separating the inside of one fig, clean the seed very well and see if they float or not on a clean glass .
If they  float, seeds are empty, no kernel ( definitely not a Smyrna) !
If they go to the bottom of the glass, they will be fertile (with kernel) and now, one from two:
-your fig is a real Smyrna , or
-it is a caprificated Common or San Pedro

Hope this helps
Cheers
francisco
persianmd2orchard

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Posted Reply with quote  #4 
Thank you for the all smyrna information. Those dried "shirazi" figs come from different cultivars so I'm not sure if the one I eat are of the same scion I have, so the test won't tell me much but is very interesting to know for future. I wish I had known there can be small smyrna figs, I would not have gotten my hopes up that just because it is small (and I mean small--maybe 2cm diameter?) that it would not be a smyrna.

I guess there is only one answer, we need wasp in DC. They won't overwinter here will they? Is there a good source to learn more about fig wasp habitat and how to keep him happy?
persianmd2orchard

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Posted Reply with quote  #5 
maybe there is a type of fig wasp somewhere in a cold place in middle east high altitude if real limiting factor is overwintering? there are hardy pomegranates, maybe there is hardy wasp!
lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #6 
It may prove difficult to keep Caprifigs in your clim.zone (7a)-
Along the Med Basin there are countries with more severe environments  (more continental) that do have and cultivate Smyrna and Caprifigs.
Here, where I live, (Southern Portugal),  they do very well because climate is very temperate without extreme temps.
Closeness to the sea, I think, makes the difference
Never snows and lowest winter temperatures never get bellow approx 10ºC-
May be a member with knowledge of Greece,  Croatia or mid/northern Italy could bring in more light on those colder (or warmer) areas where there are apparently still caprifigs
francisco
pako

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Posted Reply with quote  #7 

Hi everybady ,respect,

I live in Bulgaria(EU).Now , if you look at the map ,there is region in southwest BG ,south of Kresna village .Figs in that region are mostly Smirna type and there is a lot of spontaneous vegetation of Caprifigs.

The fig wasp is present also in Black sea region ,south of Burgas.

Even when I am ,on the northern slops of Rodopi mountain (Plovdiv-Asenovgrad region) we find a lot of spontaneous caprifigs.

Mi point is….minus 15C , even minus 20 C are not so rare in thous places.

Maybe the wasp is not so tender….

O-o-r ,if some years the wasp is death , is coming back from Greece and Turkey.

 

P.S. No wasp north of Balkan mountain (Stara Planina)

P.S.2  Ops ,I forgot, we have snow ,more o less ,but every winter.
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lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #8 
Hello Pako,

Very interesting ! I was aware that Smyrna figs could be cultivated in Bulgaria but not to the extent you are describing. I suppose you have your own distinct varieties, or do you utilize some of the neighboring cultivars.

In my area, the early Caprifigs (Profichi) are just now liberating their pollen laden wasps for pollinating some Smyrna and Common varieties carrying receptive fruit.

I would be very grateful if you could show some fig pictures and briefly describe them.

cheers
Francisco
pako

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Posted Reply with quote  #9 

Hello Francisco,

Thank you for your interest.

We have mostly foreign varieties ,but also local ones obtained by free pollination.

Brunswick and Mitchurinska 10 are most widely grown .

If you have time ,you can check our local forum about figs.

 You can find many pictures of local figs and caprifigs.

It is a small forum , but here only a few people are interested in figs.

Most of the people  think ,there are only two fig varieties-Turkish (Black) and Greek (Green)….

 http://forum.palmi.bg/viewforum.php?f=14

Forgive me my English…

Plamen
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greenfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #10 
Pako,Thanks for the forum link. I was looking through and found a nice photo of the Izmir :
http://forum.palmi.bg/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=270&sid=54dde5d87344f1b5ceefe058a8f73e92

Any chance you know what is the name used for it in the US?
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pako

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Posted Reply with quote  #11 

I am sorry Greenfig,

Nobody hire knows the true name of this fig.

It was brought from town of Izmir (Turkey),so we call it-Izmir

The photo is from the owner of the mother tree and figs are too overripe. Mi Izmir is small , second year in ground.

I can see only ,that this one is a very strong grower. Hope to get figs this season.

 

Plamen
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lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #12 
Plamen,

Thank you very much  for opening the door to the Bulgarian figs which are in fact Super !
I will certainly go about these new links and see your nice figs.

I believe that IZMIR fig is a Smyrna variety once it comes from that Region of Turkey, where a great deal of the local varieties need caprification to bear fruit.
It could be the famous Black Bursa...(black/purple skin and deep red pulp) ...

In Portugal among many varieties we do have two Smyrna figs at the top of the list  which are the most popular (mainly in the south) and widely consumed either fresh or dry. -a black and a white varieties

See the enclosed picture of these figs, probably a bit too ripe for your taste.
One day, who knows.. may be a couple of their  sticks will fly to the village of Kresna and find a good piece of soil to root and give you figs from faraway Portugal.

All the Best
Francisco

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pako

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Posted Reply with quote  #13 

Francisco,

That was my first thought…..Smirna is the old Greek name of Izmir ,so this fig mast be Smirna type.

But I just cant believe this.

My figs are in the village of Hrabrino, Plovdiv district .I never saw a Smirna fig in mine region .All my figs are Common type too…

I cant believe that Smirna fig will perform equal to Common fig in my climate.

I know well Bursa syahi fig, because every autumn markets are full with imported figs from Turkey. This Izmir fig is not Bursa Syahi.I mast tell you ,my  Brunswick ,fresh from the tree is better than that Bursa Syahi.

Probably they pick the figs not properly ripe.

Very beautiful figs ,that you have ,Francisco!

Cheers,

Plamen

 
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Dieseler

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Posted Reply with quote  #14 
Oh thats a beautiful dark fig Lampo and overripe no it looks perfect.
Mumbling no wasp here .
persianmd2orchard

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Posted Reply with quote  #15 
Thank you all so much for the information and those figs in Bulgaria and Portugal are fantastic looking!!!!
lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #16 
Plamen,

Thank you. You right, that Bursa Syahi figs to be kept in the shelf for longer periods, are picked up from the tree well before acceptable ripeness levels... maturation process is then stopped due to storage temperatures and when it reaches the European markets has lost most of its sweetness and  flavor.

Martin, I see you fancy picking and eating your figs well ripe.  Traditionally, here we pick them right when it starts bending down without letting the pulp to turn into that thick sweet syrup and with no visible sap
on the foot.

Persian,

Thanks, I am lucky living in an region which is ideal for all Mediterranean fruit.

Francisco
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