Fig Cutting orientation vs success rate

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pino

Registered:1383190021
Posts: 2,118

Posted 1429972216	Reply with quote #1

This year I seem to have had a large number of cuttings leaf out before roots developed resulting in many lost cuttings. My rooting method; - inspect, wash and clean cuttings and soak overnight in cool water, make fresh cut just below bottom node - pre-moisten sifted perlite/water (10/1 ratio) (600 ml perlite/60 ml water) - place in sealed tupperware container with cuttings placed horizontally - place container in a dark warm place (75F-80F) with constant temperature - air out every 3 days and examine cuttings for mold or root development - plant in clear deli cups when roots form or when cutting leafs out - place deli cups in humidity dome with bottom heating 75F-80F under T5 light Would like to hear other peoples experience and comments/suggestions whether my rooting method is the culprit that results in a higher percentage of leafed out cuttings prior to root development. __________________ Pino, zone 6, Niagara, JCJ Acres Wish; Peace on earth and more figs Italian 258, Galicia Negra, Luv, trade suggestions welcome.

rafaelissimmo

Registered:1335639347
Posts: 1,473

Posted 1429977969	Reply with quote #2

Pino it sounds like you are doing everything right. What medium are you using when they go into deli cups? __________________ Zone 7b, Queens, New York

brianm

Registered:1389664758
Posts: 971

Posted 1429978354	Reply with quote #3

Try experimenting without the lights and heat mat. I use neither of those and have rooted my fair share so far. Everything else looks good. __________________ Wish list: Galicia Negra,UC Davis Black Ischia, Maltese Raven

pino

Registered:1383190021
Posts: 2,118

Posted 1429980708	Reply with quote #4

Thanks Brian. I have noticed that too high (i.e. >80F) a temperature does seem to create issues in that the bottom of the cups dry out so I have lowered the temp to 78F will try lowering a little more. Rafael I had a bad experience earlier this year with Promix BX so for now I am using sunshine mix #4 with a little more perlite added. I am getting some Promix HP as soon as the co-op get more inventory. However, I don't pot up the cuttings until after they either root or leaf out. My question is does the initial rooting of the cuttings horizontally result in a larger percentage of cuttings leafing out before roots are formed. Or as Brian suggested maybe the temperature is a factor? I keep the cuttings in the dark until leaves form only then do I put in cups and move them to lights. I am thinking that when cuttings are rooted vertically with bottom heating this results in higher temps around the bottom and thus promoting roots before leaves. Where if the cuttings are rooted horizontally the temp is the same and leaves tend to form first. I don't know the answer but I am hoping the more experienced members have more insight in this. __________________ Pino, zone 6, Niagara, JCJ Acres Wish; Peace on earth and more figs Italian 258, Galicia Negra, Luv, trade suggestions welcome.

rafaelissimmo

Registered:1335639347
Posts: 1,473

Posted 1429987646	Reply with quote #5

I have a cutting horizontal in sealed tray in coir on heatmat with lights right now, it has nice roots and no leaf breaking bud, I did use a hormone. __________________ Zone 7b, Queens, New York

rafaelissimmo

Registered:1335639347
Posts: 1,473

Posted 1429991135 · Edited	Reply with quote #6

Btw I think even Promix HP might be too dense unless the cups drain really well. Depending on the drainage factor, you may want to add a healthy dose of coarse, screened perlite to your mix. I find that drilling holes in bottom and even sides of cups has proven insufficient, and this drainage problem is the reason I am souring on this method until I can find a better solution to up-potting from tray to chamber. Probably Pete's SIPs are a good idea, but I have had great success with cloner this year. __________________ Zone 7b, Queens, New York

james

Registered:1189185103
Posts: 1,653

Posted 1429991429	Reply with quote #7

A lady at the local hydroponic shop said they recommend temps not over 72F/22C. Around 75F and mold growth accelerates. __________________ In containers - Littleton, CO (zone 5b) In ground - N.E of Austin, TX (zone 8b) 2016 Wish List: Dārk Pōrtuguese, Grānthāms Royāl, Lātarolla, Negrettā, Nōire de Bārbentāne, Rockāway Green, Viōlet Sepōr, Viōlette Dāuphine. Iranian figs are always welcome.

figpig_66

Registered:1416870358
Posts: 2,678

Posted 1429994173	Reply with quote #8

Pino i root in deli containers in the dark and i find if you brake off long new growth if no roots. this forces or give cutting time and energy towards root development. I also leave the new growth that i broke off in container and have them make roots. Give it a go. works grate. Some varieties make roots with ease some i brake off new growth. But as far as your method your doing everything right. __________________ RICHIE BONI HICKORY LOUISIANA ZONE 8B WARM HUMID WINRERS ARE VERY MILD LOW 20'S BUT WARMS RIGHT UP DURING THE DAY. SUMMER IS EXTREMELY HOT & HUMID 100 degrees 100% humidity fig tree grow like crazy but some split from rain & humidity Wish list. Col de dame blanc Col de rimada Lsu numbered figs

pino

Registered:1383190021
Posts: 2,118

Posted 1430010700 · Edited	Reply with quote #9

Thanks for the suggestions! add more coarse perlite to soil mix over 50/50 lower temp to 72-75F from 79F I am going to hold off on pinch green shoots/leaves if no roots. Will hope that light and some misting will keep fig alive until roots formed. __________________ Pino, zone 6, Niagara, JCJ Acres Wish; Peace on earth and more figs Italian 258, Galicia Negra, Luv, trade suggestions welcome.

rafaelissimmo

Registered:1335639347
Posts: 1,473

Posted 1430071593	Reply with quote #10

Pino u might kill buds by breaking them off, be careful on that last item. __________________ Zone 7b, Queens, New York

pino

Registered:1383190021
Posts: 2,118

Posted 1430075737	Reply with quote #11

Thanks Rafael! I guess it is a trade off. The leafed out cutting will likely not make it without roots at the same time by snipping the new growth you could set it back and it may never grow. This is why I hate getting leaves before roots..lol __________________ Pino, zone 6, Niagara, JCJ Acres Wish; Peace on earth and more figs Italian 258, Galicia Negra, Luv, trade suggestions welcome.

JoAnn749

Registered:1325443625
Posts: 1,184

Posted 1430196615	Reply with quote #12

I rooted cuttings horizontal only using orchid moss, room temp, no extra heat. I remember some varieties leafed out more then others while rooting - again they were all done the same way. Attached Images DSC00660a.jpg (390.47 KB, 30 views) __________________ Jo-Ann DFW TX, Zone 7b-8a Wish List: Black Madeira,, Kathleen's Black, Malta Black, Marseille VS Black, White Paradisio, LSU Scott's Black, Conadria, White Trianna, Marttineca Rimada, Excel, Peter's Honey, Bebera Preta (Abebereira), Strawberry Verte

cis4elk

Registered:1347840383
Posts: 1,719

Posted 1430200709 · Edited	Reply with quote #13

I usually leave them in the bag/bin if they start growing shoots before roots. If they look like they are really close to growing roots they will get cupped up, but sometimes this fails. If I leave them in the bag, I find the worst thing that happens is the shoot will rot at the tip or maybe a little more but when I cup them up(them being cuttings I kept in the bag longer because of no roots) the majority of the time they will grow a new little bud on at one of the internodes on the partially rotted shoot, and they usually send out other side shoots as well. I should mention that when I force them to stay in the bag until I see some root activity, I bury them sort of deep when I finally cup them. The result is usually the majority of the original cutting wood being buried and/or at least half of the white(ish) new shoot growth which may or may not be partially rotted gets buried. I find a good percentage of the time, if the new shoot is even the slightest bit discolored at the tip, it will die back one or two nodes of blanched new growth. So, I try guestimate where that point will be when I cup the cutting and have that area near the soil level(slightly below, above or at soil level). These are all cuttings that were forced to stay in the bag. Most of the original shoot that started to grow before the roots has rotted away and been new replaced or that shoot sprout buds producing some of this growth. These might have done nothing and eventually shriveled if I cupped them too early. I just have poor luck with cuttings if I cup them too early, then they just sit there forever until they eventually rot and die. __________________ Calvin Littleton,CO z5/6 Wants List: For everyone to clean-up after themselves and co-exist peacefully. Let's think more about the future of our planet and less about ourselves. :)

AltadenaMara

Registered:1422990132
Posts: 375

Posted 1430223544	Reply with quote #14

I don't like ripening the cuttings in the bag at all to begin with. I lost half my cuttings the first time I tried it. They sit there and don't know where to make roots, where to make sprouts, then mostly make mold. Many of the cuttings you get have been sitting in someone's fridge for weeks if not months already. I prefer to wrap the top of the cuttings in Buddy tape, put a rooting hormone on the bottom two nodes, and put the cuttings directly into 50/50 coir/perilite cups on a heating mat under lights. Around 80% of my cuttings root that way without any fuss. If they don't root within a reasonable amount of time, I dump them, then put them in a wet paper towel/baggie/ warm area. One CdDN sat for almost three months in a baggie before starting to grow, but is rooting nicely now. If they leaf out before there are sufficient roots to support the top growth, I add a humidity dome and misting. I've found for some variety cuttings, nothing works. I've had two batches of cuttings from eBay that flat refuse to root, no matter what I do. One set of cuttings was dipped in hot wax on each end. Perhaps wax that was too hot killed the ends? Or perhaps they were just old and dried out. __________________ Mara Southern California Zone 1990= 9b 2012= 10a 2020=?

rcantor

Registered:1309799312
Posts: 5,727

Posted 1430240452	Reply with quote #15

I would never cut off green growth from a cutting. Leaves make food for the cutting. You might have to water the bag more, or if things are wilting you might have to cut part of the leaf off.. You don't know if the cutting will have the energy to push new growth. As for the bag method, it works fine if you follow the general principles. If The cutting gets moldy either the cutting was dead or there's too much water. If you buy coarse perlite there are a lot of fine particles that hold a lot of water. You have to sift or rinse those out before using the perlite. Similarly, if you add peat or potting soil add only a tiny amount. I use Agricultural grade perlite #3. It has a larger particle size and so larger airspaces as well. You can get that through hydroponics stores. __________________ Zone 6, MO Wish list: Galicia Negra, De La Reina - Pons, Genovese Nero - Rafed's, Sbayi, Souadi, Acciano, Any Rimada, Sodus Sicilian, any Bass, Pons or Axier fig, any great tasting fig.

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