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GeneDaniels

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Posted Reply with quote  #1 
Well its official now. 100% of the cuttings I tried to start indoor over the winter have now failed. Some molded in bags, others died in cups of perilite, a few made it to 1 gal pots -- only to die there. Complete failure. I will not try that again.

The only bright spot is that I held a few of the cuttings sent me in the fridge. I waited until about 3 weeks ago and buried each one, sideways 1 in deep, in a pot of plain potting soil. Out of that group, 2 are showing signs of life, 1 Negronne and 1 Black Jack. Will wait and see about the rest.

In the future, no more complicated winter rooting stuff for me. Just bag 'em in the fridge until early spring then bury them straight into pots.



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Zone 7b (Central Arkansas) Seven trees in the ground: Hardy Chicago, Celeste(?), LSU gold, Italian Black, Southern Brown Turkey(?), Strawberry Verte, and Unk yellow.  Trees in pots: VdB, CdD, and Sicilian?
dkirtexas

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Posted Reply with quote  #2 
I never used the bag method, I use clear shoeboxes with damp moss, put the cuttings in, leave them alone, 75-80% success.  Put cuttings in potting soil, in 1 gal pots, put pots in deep plastic tub with lid, 75-80%.   Stick cuttings in pot of potting soil, put in full shade, water, 75-80% (this is almost 100% when done when the cuttings are dormant).  Luck, methodology, voodoo, cuttings, who knows.
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Thx, glad to be here

Danny K "EL CAZADOR DE HIGO"
Waskom Tx Zone 7B/8

Wish list: anything anyone wants me to have. LSU RED.  Any LSU fig.
privateer

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Posted Reply with quote  #3 
try putting some in a vase of rainwater. Let the roots grow a few months. Transplant to pint clear plastic cups with no holes. Keep soil fairly wet until new roots show. Put drainage holes in cup. Works for me every year!  
WillsC

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Posted Reply with quote  #4 
That had to be very disappointing Gene.  
GeneDaniels

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Posted Reply with quote  #5 
Yeah, I put a lot of time and "love" into cuttings over the winter. Oh well, they are just plants. No, no, they are figs! But nothing else I can do. But I do have lots of hope for the potted cuttings.
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Zone 7b (Central Arkansas) Seven trees in the ground: Hardy Chicago, Celeste(?), LSU gold, Italian Black, Southern Brown Turkey(?), Strawberry Verte, and Unk yellow.  Trees in pots: VdB, CdD, and Sicilian?
bullet08

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Posted Reply with quote  #6 
gene, i know it doesn't help, but take what you did this time as learning point and don't make the same mistake again next winter. my first winter rooting was hideous. lost some more interesting cuttings, and didn't know what to do. then i ran into more problem in the spring. but i kept a mental note on things i did wrong. learned to feel how much to wet the soil. using different things so the roots are not disturbed while moving to 1 gal. small things. cutting with roots are put in the put after i poke a good size hold in the soil mix so the roots get damaged less. keep cuttings and humidity bin so they will get extra warmth and moisture in the air.. 

spring rooting is much easier, but some of the good cuttings come out in the fall/winter.. i guess you can store them, but same issue to a lesser degree will come up. during the spring, things are moving faster so we don't stop to get the cutting in a trouble. 
 
gool luck on your spring rooting. 
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Pete
Durham, NC
Zone 7b

"don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy and the lash." - sir winston churchill
"the problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." - the baroness thatcher

***** all my figs have FMV/FMD, in case you're wondering. *****
***** and... i don't sell things. what little i have will be posted here in winter for first come first serve base to be shared. no, i'm not a socialist...*****
javajunkie

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Posted Reply with quote  #7 
I'm really sorry to hear that Gene. That sucks! But, Pete's right, keep a note of it and you won't make the same mistakes twice.
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Tami
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susieqz

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Posted Reply with quote  #8 
well, you're not alone. so far i've lost 90% of every cutting i've tried. looks like that includes those you were kind enow to send me.

i guess i'll have to just buy trees.
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susie 
wish list:  nothing. i can't grow cuttings  . right now, i have  6 trees showing no signs of fmv. i'd like to keep it that way' 

i was told that if i couldn't deal with fmv, i should grow peaches, so i got a peach tree to live with my clean figs.
SCfigFanatic

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Posted Reply with quote  #9 
Hang in there.
Experience is the best medicine.
Keep trying, give it less water. (that where its easy to kill em)
Just have fun at learning.



Doug
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Posted Reply with quote  #10 
Yeah....starting cuttings in Winter is fight!  There are too many things that just cause failure beyond one's control.  Someone mentioned the water method and I have to agree with them.  Starting cutting in water works quite well.  I've switched to a progation water method.  Once potted up just give the cuttings a sterile mix like Pro-Mix and some weak liquid fertilizer and B1 vitamins.  It works pretty well.  I'll post a pic of my setup later.
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Dennis
Charlotte, North Carolina/Zone 8a 
GeneDaniels

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Posted Reply with quote  #11 
Quote:
Originally Posted by susieqz
well, you're not alone. so far i've lost 90% of every cutting i've tried. looks like that includes those you were kind enow to send me.

i guess i'll have to just buy trees.


Suzie, I kept a few cuttings like those I sent you. I just laid them in pots, sideways, and covered them with dirt. EVERY ONE of them is coming up through the soil. I will have more than I can give away locally, so as long as they survive the summer I could send you a small bare root of both the unknown green and unknown yellow. Remind me in the fall. 
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Zone 7b (Central Arkansas) Seven trees in the ground: Hardy Chicago, Celeste(?), LSU gold, Italian Black, Southern Brown Turkey(?), Strawberry Verte, and Unk yellow.  Trees in pots: VdB, CdD, and Sicilian?
milehighgirl

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Posted Reply with quote  #12 
I admit to being a newbie, but I also agree with Pete (Bullet08). You have already learned so much, i.e.: You have learned that it's wise to not start all the cuttings at the same time. Much of what you have learned can transmit to other plants besides figs, not to mention to a next generation. I suspect that if most of us here had been taught from knee-high we wouldn't have to be here! 
Quote:
take what you did this time as learning point and don't make the same mistake again next winter.


I also agree with dkrtexas:
Quote:
 I use clear shoeboxes with damp moss, put the cuttings in, leave them alone


I had what I thought was beginners luck last year but I guess it wasn't luck as I took the knowledge from Tom (tcm2009). So I have learned that what I did last year worked for me as far as rooting and potting, but I have lost 50% of those cuttings now during the winter. I have learned that I will need to water about once a month while they are in the garage. I actually knew this already but became concerned about roots rotting because others have posted warnings about it. My climate is quite arid and I have to take that into consideration when trying something someone else has success with. I have learned from over-wintering other types of plants that the best way to water in the winter is to freeze water in waxed cardboard milk containers, then cut away the bottom, which will allow the moisture to absorb into dry soil without just running through. (This is what I will do next year). All of my trees in 10 gallon pots survived the winter without a hitch, so I am thinking that a larger pot with more soil for protection might also help.

All this to say, "don't give up"!!!
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USDA Zone 5b, Sunset 2b

Looking for: Becane, Dalmatie, Doree, Florea, Hanc's EBT, Italian 258, LaRadek's EBT, Longue d'Aout, Marseilles White , Negronne, Nordland, Sal's EL, Strawberry Vert, ...anything cold hardy and short season. (Willing to pay for cuttings)
donpaid

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Posted Reply with quote  #13 
Happens to everyone at some point. Last year, I also had 100% failure. This year, had about 20% failure. The good news is, it can only get better! When it comes to propagation experience, it's quantity over quality (i.e. try to root a variety that is abundant and easy to find in your area, Celeste or BT or LSU "Blank", and try to root like 100 sticks) it's all about practice

Thanks for sharing! Best of luck!
ForeverFigs

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Posted Reply with quote  #14 
Gene...sorry to hear about your winter disaster...I gave up winter rooting about 2 seasons ago because of serious gnat infestation...now I don't even look at a cutting until April. 
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Vince
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ako1974

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Posted Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkirtexas
I never used the bag method, I use clear shoeboxes with damp moss, put the cuttings in, leave them alone, 75-80% success.  Put cuttings in potting soil, in 1 gal pots, put pots in deep plastic tub with lid, 75-80%.   Stick cuttings in pot of potting soil, put in full shade, water, 75-80% (this is almost 100% when done when the cuttings are dormant).  Luck, methodology, voodoo, cuttings, who knows.


This might seem like a dumb question - I haven't been growing figs very long - but are the success rates you mention above getting the cuttings to root or successfully getting them potted and growing? I had decent success this season rooting (75%), hopefully the potted up sticks keep growing.

The thing I'm being careful about is watering. When I potted up, I soaked them reasonably good and have left them since (maybe a week). They seem fine, but should I err toward the side of being more dry? Like other plants, should I give it the one-inch finger poke in the soil test? Right now, they're all inside with a light on them, so they're not getting dried up outside....

Arne
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Arne
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Joe_Athens1945

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Posted Reply with quote  #16 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkirtexas
I never used the bag method, I use clear shoeboxes with damp moss, put the cuttings in, leave them alone, 75-80% success.  Put cuttings in potting soil, in 1 gal pots, put pots in deep plastic tub with lid, 75-80%.   Stick cuttings in pot of potting soil, put in full shade, water, 75-80% (this is almost 100% when done when the cuttings are dormant).  Luck, methodology, voodoo, cuttings, who knows.


Excellent advice, Danny. And happy hunting, btw.
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My young trees in the ground and in pots: Brown Turkey, White Triana JM, Magnolia, Strawberry Verte, Violette de Bordeaux, Panache, UK Brooklyn Dark JP, Ronde de Bordeaux.
 
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blueboy1977

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Posted Reply with quote  #17 
I feel your pain Gene, I lost most all of my cuttings I started in Feb. Only 4 of 30 something cuttings made it and are actively growing now. My second round of cuttings are doing better. Only lost about half of them so far. Just keep on keeping on!
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Rob
Zone 9a/9b were the too meet. South Houston Tx

Growing:  Black Madeira, Smith, LSU Scott's Black, Improved Celeste, VDB, MBvs, RDB, Unknown Peach/Apricot, Salce, Malta Black, Texas BA-1, JH Adriatic, Atreano, CDDN, CDDB, CDDG, Strawberry Verte
drphil69

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Posted Reply with quote  #18 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ako1974
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkirtexas
I never used the bag method, I use clear shoeboxes with damp moss, put the cuttings in, leave them alone, 75-80% success.  Put cuttings in potting soil, in 1 gal pots, put pots in deep plastic tub with lid, 75-80%.   Stick cuttings in pot of potting soil, put in full shade, water, 75-80% (this is almost 100% when done when the cuttings are dormant).  Luck, methodology, voodoo, cuttings, who knows.


This might seem like a dumb question - I haven't been growing figs very long - but are the success rates you mention above getting the cuttings to root or successfully getting them potted and growing? I had decent success this season rooting (75%), hopefully the potted up sticks keep growing.

The thing I'm being careful about is watering. When I potted up, I soaked them reasonably good and have left them since (maybe a week). They seem fine, but should I err toward the side of being more dry? Like other plants, should I give it the one-inch finger poke in the soil test? Right now, they're all inside with a light on them, so they're not getting dried up outside....

Arne


I got mine to 1 gallons and was very stingy with water for about 2 months.  I judged when they needed it by weight, then only gave about 4 oz dilute MG each watering.  Initially about 1x per week, then as they grew more often.  I am new also but had 100% success up potting.  Keeping barely enough water for them seems to work real well.

Phil
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Phil - Zone 7A - Newark, DE Newbie fig lover just trying to learn.
drphil69

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Posted Reply with quote  #19 
Sorry about your troubles, Gene.

A very generous member gave me a bunch of Celeste cuttings, I have extras if you want them, PM me.

Phil
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GeneDaniels

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Posted Reply with quote  #20 
Quote:
Originally Posted by drphil69
Sorry about your troubles, Gene.

A very generous member gave me a bunch of Celeste cuttings, I have extras if you want them, PM me.

Phil


Thanks for the offer Phil, but I will decline. The greatest losses were the Battaglia Green, Italian 258, and Sari Zeybek. Those may be hard to ever replace. Oh well...

But I still have several cuttings that I started outdoors in pots a month ago. Some of them are starting to bud, so I am still have hope. One Negronne, Ronde de Bordeaux, Black Jack, and two Hardy Chicagos are all showing signs of life. I also have mulitiple UNK green and UNK Yellow (from a near-by tree) that are sprouting. So I lost several nice varieties, but all is not lost.
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Zone 7b (Central Arkansas) Seven trees in the ground: Hardy Chicago, Celeste(?), LSU gold, Italian Black, Southern Brown Turkey(?), Strawberry Verte, and Unk yellow.  Trees in pots: VdB, CdD, and Sicilian?
Norhayati

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Posted Reply with quote  #21 
Sorry Gene about those winter failures. I hope you will have better luck next time.

Norhayati
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jdsfrance

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Posted Reply with quote  #22 
Hi Genedaniels,
When did you start rooting them ?

I no longer start before January because of lack of daylight .
Are the cuttings still so so or did you already toss them ?
Mine were starting to look so so, so they are now at the garden - I don't expect frost bites anymore for this year.
So they are still looking like alive and there is still hope.
As I mentioned, outside, the dirt does dry faster which is good for the cuttings and everyday temp drop keep the gnats and mold in control.
Just throw a plate with a bit of water under the pot and let it be.
You just need to monitor the rain - in rainy days empty and remove the plate .

I had a cutting put lots of growth to suddenly collapse . Gnats are around. But I still don't get the reason for that sudden collapse ...
I put the pot at the garden. If she wants to bounce back, I'll welcome her .
The only trees that are still at home are my seedlings as those look truly like weeds - transparent "trunks" - So I'll have to keep them a month or two more inside .
Just a remark : Gnats are not interested in the pots with the seedlings ...
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GeneDaniels

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Posted Reply with quote  #23 
There are two that are still in cups, they look like maybe, just maybe they will live. The rest I have gotten rid of because they were starting to rot.

I did salvage one Negronne cutting before it rotted and buried it in a pot. It gets half-day sun. It is showing signs of life again so maybe??

But next year I will not even attempt the indoor thing. Just wait until May and then bury them in pots, sideways, under 1-2 inches of good potting soil. All the cuttings I took locally seem to love this method, and it fits my style since I travel some and can't baby the cuttings over long periods of time.
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Zone 7b (Central Arkansas) Seven trees in the ground: Hardy Chicago, Celeste(?), LSU gold, Italian Black, Southern Brown Turkey(?), Strawberry Verte, and Unk yellow.  Trees in pots: VdB, CdD, and Sicilian?
lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #24 
P1050252.jpg  P1050253.jpg 


Had always mixed results (poor!) following certain methods said to be modern and efficient.

Still do most in water and latelly,  also wrapping the sticks in moist newspaper and to keep them for 3 or 4 weeks inside a plastic bag hanging on a nail in side the laundry room, with occasional checks

For me both systems are OK, the moist newspaper being the one which generates more and stronger roots, sometimes so much that I am obliged to pot a bushy cutting together with its newspaper envelope for sake of not damaging any root... it works fine ! I would say close to  100% sucess.

On a couple of occasions dry sticks, treated with this system have practically resuscitated.
On both systems it is paramount to keep an acceptable level of moisture around the cutting

Have a look on the pics showing my last two cuttings from new edible seedlings, having created some roots being in water from the last days of March until today.

Francisco
GeneDaniels

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Posted Reply with quote  #25 
Those look great! I will check the remaining cuttings I have to see if any of them are candidates for water rooting. It can't hurt.
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Zone 7b (Central Arkansas) Seven trees in the ground: Hardy Chicago, Celeste(?), LSU gold, Italian Black, Southern Brown Turkey(?), Strawberry Verte, and Unk yellow.  Trees in pots: VdB, CdD, and Sicilian?
greenfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #26 
Francisco,

Your cuttings look awesome!
What water do you use (tap/rain) and how often do you replace it with the fresh one (if any)?
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lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #27 
Gene,

Rooting in water may require cuttings with a certain mass... say in excess of 10" and thick ..3/4, 1" or more.
If your cuttings are thin, I would rather go for the 'moist newspaper' technique.
Always used tap water but being exposed, the bucket would also collect the occasional rain water... renew every 5/6 days

Igor,

As said above I used tap water and think rain water should be all right
A friend, showed me recently his system for rooting all sorts of cuttings..
A cylindrical transparent glass jug not too deep with various  diff cuttings (figs included).Instead of water he had filled with a willow tea he prepares with young willow shoots. All kept inside a plastic translucent bag inside his tool room.

The sticks shown on those two pictures were fully exposed, on the back of the laundry room, facing West..... in the shade until 13-AM , then getting full sun all afternoon. These two were the last but I had potted other, rooted on that same bucket with many leaves and several new shoots, all thick cuttings

Francisco
greenfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #28 
Francisco,

Just to make sure I understand, your friend keeps the cuttings in the willow tea all the time, right?
Not just leave the cuttings to soak overnight – or for several hours – long enough to absorb the rooting hormone, and then continue rooting in the plain water.
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lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #29 
Igor,

Yes the cuttings are kept inside the jug for several days or even weeks but he may eventually replace the tea.
He claims rapid root development
I will try this  later in the season to see the results

Francisco
greenfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #30 
Ah! Wonderful.
I would like to try this too, I have a number of cuttings sitting in the glasses with tap water.
Just need to find a willow around LA.
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lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #31 
Igor,

In LA you find ALL things !

Even Caprifigs full of free and friendly wasps and to make you much happier with your figging !!

Have a look on this clip,



Found it interesting and  very instructive.

Good luck

Francisco
greenfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #32 
Thanks, Francisco! I Googled a bit after you mentioned the Willow tea and found a completely different recipe for the tea preparation:
http://gardensinspired.blogspot.com/2012/01/willow-tea-as-rooting-hormone.html

In short, no leaves and boiled water instead of what is in the video.
The outcome might be the same though.

Ok, I want to try it now.
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lampo

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Posted Reply with quote  #33 
Igor,

This 'formula' is more elaborated and may be more convincing..



Seen already in this forum somewhere, when there was talk and clips about rooting grafts, the finished root stock+scion assemblies been put to soak on a dark and apparently thick fluid as the guy on the video describes.. seen it ??

Francisco
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