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Encanto Farms Nursery > Topics > Improved Celeste and Florea,The earliest varieties to ripe,here.
 
 


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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #1 
These 2 cultivar will ripe Breba and second crop,continuously without interruption between the 2 crops,and they can start churning ripe fruits ,on or before June 24 here in NJ,as it was the case in 2012.
Both are very hardy,with proven record ,for Florea and good record for ,Improved Celeste (O'Rourke not).
I recommend these 2 as a must have for any gardener that intend to grow fig trees in zones 7,6,and 5.,as base trees to built on.
And I firmly state that a fig tree is the most rewarding ,most important fruit tree a Garden must Have.
I grew most fruit tree kind,and I found out fig tree is the most willing to reward and please the grower(Granting the cultivar is adapted, for the specific climate).
If you know of a different cultivar,as early to ripe as these 2,by all means chime in.
First pix:Florea

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jpeg Florea_breba0.JPG (115.10 KB, 441 views)
jpeg ImprovedCeleste2011.jpg (81.29 KB, 434 views)
ejp3

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Posted Reply with quote  #2 
Any taste difference?  Which better in your opinion.  Florea ripens first dosen't it?
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Johnparav

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Posted Reply with quote  #3 
Thanks Vasile ,

Always on the look out for varieties you recommend . If they thrive in your climate they should do well here too ..
Splitting is a problem with a lot of the varieties , but if they don't split with all the rain you've been getting the last couple years then were good .

John
DesertDance

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Posted Reply with quote  #4 
I wonder how Florea does in a Mediterranean climate.  I have 3 rooted Florea.  I'll pot one, put one in a gopher basket, and put one in a crack between huge rocks.  I will report on the results for a Mediterranean climate.

Suzi
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saxonfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #5 
Good stuff to know Vasile.

I have Florea from you but I haven't established Improved Celeste yet. It sure has a long neck doesn't it. How's the flavor of O'Rourke compared to regular Celeste?

EDIT: Improved Celeste is not O'Rourke.
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nkesh099

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Posted Reply with quote  #6 
Thank you Vasile for your report. I do not grow the IC and Florea, but the two fig cultivators that ripen (main crop- I always remove the breba crops) the earliest are; O'Rourke and my UDG.

Navid.
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #7 
JohnParav:Florea splits and sour bad here if it get ripe while is raining,and Improved Celeste ,sour a little with much rain,but last Summer even regular Celeste soured,,but here it is about getting ripe early,not about splitting or souring during rain.
Most climates in the north and north east are dryer than NJ, and many cultivars that sour and split in NJ do not do that in colder northern climates.
Saxonfig,I am talking about Improved Celeste not O 'Rourke Celeste.
So far ,from what other are  finding out O'Rourke Celeste is only MaRGINALLY COLD HARDY.
hoosierbanana

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Posted Reply with quote  #8 
H2- What do you think of Improved Celeste for commercial production? Do you know if IC was included in the University of Maryland trial that MBvs won?
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Giuseppe

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Posted Reply with quote  #9 

Vasile,

can you please tell me how hardy are Florea and improved Celeste.Is Florea is a good tasting fig?I have a new rooted Florea cutting and whant to
taste this fig for hardiness in my zone.Ciao,
Giuseppe
snaglpus

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Posted Reply with quote  #10 
The first to ripen in my area last year was Florea and Marseilles and Improved Celeste. We had no rain for a while and my little Florea had 3 figs on. The color changed and the birds got the first one. I covered up the other 2 and got to taste them. They were great and so were IC. In my opinion, you can't go wrong with IC.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #11 
Brent:For Commercial production,Improved Celeste would be very good,in my opinion,but not in others opinion,that can object that the fruit is too small,for fresh fruit.
This is Why,Marseilles Black was abandoned in Maryland trials,it was the most productive the most cold tolerant,but too small in their opinion for fresh market.
Improved Celeste is a new cultivar produce by a new Generation,and it was not trialed in Maryland.
Improved Celeste is about the size of Marseilles black if not a little smaller.
If I was going to make preserves,fig wine ,or moon shine(for that matter),the 2 above have no competition.
Giuseppe:Florea is very good tasting,in cold ,and hot climates,like yours,and other most climates where there is not a lot of rain in July and August when it get ripe.
Many people from such climates wrote on this Forum and the Garden web,as for how good it taste,in their local climates.
In my local climate it was not doing very well,and I found it as an exception.
Violette de Bordeaux,is having problems here too,tho it is the best tasting in most other climates.
As for how hardy Florea is:Giuseppe,the answer is,the most hardy i ever seen.
Johnparav

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Posted Reply with quote  #12 
Vasile ,

I agree the early ripening is exactly what we need here also . Last year the rains started late August and on . So an early ripening variety is ideal .

John
kubota1

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Posted Reply with quote  #13 
Vasile,
 Would you say that Florea is your most cold hardy fig?

Art
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #14 
I ever had!
springlakenj

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Posted Reply with quote  #15 
Well, I guess I'm adding Florea to the wish list LOL.
Hopefully be a nice combo of early ripening in NJ and cold hardy.
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saxonfig

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Posted Reply with quote  #16 
- H2. Oops! I should have read your post more closely. My brain saw that you were saying that IC and O'Rourke are the same. Just want to make sure that everyone knows that is NOT the case. Sorry, didn't mean to add any confusion.

This is very good to hear about Improved Celeste. Early ripening should mean more fully ripe fruits on the tree before cool weather hits. Vasile, can you say a little more about fruit production on IC? Does it slow down or stop in late summer or does it produce right up until frost?

I don't have this one yet and it sounds like one I should try it for my area. Does anyone have an Improved Celeste tree for sale? I can pay via paypal or by mail.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #17 
Improved Celeste(O'Rourke not),made fruits continuously from June 24,till frost,and so does Florea.
jenniferarino83

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Posted Reply with quote  #18 
I cannot wait till mine gets ripe
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Giuseppe

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Posted Reply with quote  #19 

Vasile,
thanks for bringing Florea to the States.Ciao,
Giuseppe
cis4elk

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Posted Reply with quote  #20 
Durio Nursery calls Improved Celeste/O'Rourke. Does anyone know is this really O'Rourke or is it the Improved Celeste like Vasile has? I'm just looking for a good place to get a clean Improved Celeste(O'Rourke Not).
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garden_whisperer

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Posted Reply with quote  #21 
Where can I get some of each? Let me know. I have a blue celeste but it drops em all. So if I can find these two that would be awsome.
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Bass

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Posted Reply with quote  #22 
Good to hear your good experience about the improved Celeste variant, since the improved Celeste that Lsu officially released as o'rourke does it mean that this is not originally from LSu?
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #23 
The Improved Celeste(O 'Rourke not),is in my opinion,made By Dr O'Rourke too,because he is the only scientist that created new improved hybrids of Celeste.
California program was never interested in Celeste due to small size and red interior.
O'Rourke Fig in my opinion(based on my observation),is not a Celeste hybrid selection,but a ---Southern Brown Turkey hybrid selection,made by Dr O'Rourke.
It is improper called O'Rourke Celeste
It should be called Dr.O'Rourke fig cultivar!
Bass

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Posted Reply with quote  #24 
Is the improved Celeste you have the same one that James robin sells? I got that and recently got orourke straight from Lsu, since they seem different.
Thanks for the observation.
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garden_whisperer

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Posted Reply with quote  #25 
Bass do you sell these two trees? How is fig drop. Its a problem with my blue celeste. I haven't got a single ripe fig from it here in illinois. This is the last year I will give it a chance. I need early ripening figs that are cold hardy to zone 6. So far my hardy chicago sets ripe fruit first aroung aug.
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timclymer

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Posted Reply with quote  #26 
I've purchased "O'Rourke" from Petals from the Past.  The plants were in great condition and had great roots.  However after leafing out it became apparent that they didn't have the leaf pattern of the true O'Rourke.  I got to sample a couple figs from these this year and they didn't match the description of O'Rourke figs in color.  I know leaf patterns and fig color can vary but this was pretty significantly different (especially the leaf pattern).

Based on this, I'm thinking that Petals is likely a good, inexpensive source for LSU Improved Celeste, even though they call it O'Rourke.  Here's a link to their description.  They even quote that "O'Rourke is generally called improved Celeste" in their product description.  One of LSU's own publications even states something similar.  I'm certainly not trying to give anyone a bad name, just pointing out that keeping these cultivars straight is somewhat confusing.

I have some O'Rourke cuttings from a good source that I'm rooting this year.  Hopefully I'll be able to compare them side-by-side at some point growing in this climate to be more easily able to tell the difference.
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snaglpus

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Posted Reply with quote  #27 
Improved Celeste is different from O'Rourke.  Here's another link:

http://figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/ORourke-Improved-Celeste-WHATEVER!-5925025
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Dennis
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garden_whisperer

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Posted Reply with quote  #28 
Dennis the link is no good. when i click on it it says it cant be found.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #29 
Here is the Mother of Dr O'Rourke fig cultivar,(top of pix,showing Southern Brown Turkey)
The bottom fruits are Celeste for comparison.
Notice the closed eye Southern Brown turkey has:That was what DR O'Rourke was after,Closed eye,and he successfully created O'Rourke cultivar very similar to Mother tree but with larger fruits.
Dr O Rourke used many different female cultivar in creating the hybrid selections,like LSu Purple,Scot's black,LSU Gold,etc.
However ,he did have only one male caprifig that he used in all crosses,so all LSU new selections are sister on father side,but not on mother side.
Nowadays LSU simplified,information,like they all come from a Celeste mother and a caprifig father,but ,I doubt.

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jpeg SouthernBrownJRTurkey3Celeste.jpg (94.52 KB, 166 views)
shah8

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Posted Reply with quote  #30 
You all talking about early main season figs?  Wouldn't RdB be one of the key varieties?
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Probable desired fig: Smith, St Jean, JH Adriatic, CddB, Gulbun, Pastilliere, Sucrette

Rooting:  Smith, CDDB--this pretty much means I have my fun tries (tho' important since they are truly desirable), and only interested for this year: Gulbun, BM, 187-25, or something wildly exotic or precious that nobody has any good reason to send me.
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #31 
I have Ronde de B,but it is too young to know if it will be as early as the above.
So Far it was not.
I am talking facts at this point in time.
cis4elk

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Posted Reply with quote  #32 
Vasile,

What is the leaf pattern(how many lobes) of your Improved Celeste(O'Rourke Not)?
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #33 
Three lobes leaves.
alan7s

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Posted Reply with quote  #34 
Do any nurseries sell cuttings or only plants?  I am in zone 6 and would
like to try this Florea if it is that hardy.
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pawpawbill

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Posted Reply with quote  #35 
How does Florea taste? It looks a little similar to brown turkey
cis4elk

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Posted Reply with quote  #36 
Thanks Vasile.
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #37 
How can it be similar to Brown Turkey,when it get ripe a couple of month earlier?
In My climate Brown Turkey,California and English ,start ripening at the end of August and trickle one by one trough November.
Most fruits remain unripe when frost come.
If it ripe properly in suitable climate Florea,it is a very good tasting fig,way better than BT.
drivewayfarmer

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Posted Reply with quote  #38 
Florea has done very well here in NH. I planted in the ground and cover it for Winter. A post called "Herman made me do it" shows what I did here to protect it. 
A friend bought a plant from me which is now 3 years old , she got 40 figs last season and is extremely happy with it. Doesn't even care to try another fig variety she is so happy with Florea.
She planted hers in the ground and for Winter covers it with a cardboard box , fills that with straw and puts a tarp over that.
Florea seems to set fruit easily here. When I go to pinch to encourage fruit set , it already has set fruit.
A great variety for this area , Thanks very much Vasile for sharing Florea !
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pawpawbill

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Posted Reply with quote  #39 
I am looking forward to planting this outdoors. Thanks, Herman and Kerry!
pawpawbill

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Posted Reply with quote  #40 
Herman, I did not mean to insult you or Florea. I am anxiously awaiting my plant. I was just curious for a description of the fruit.

Bill, TN 7
noss

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Posted Reply with quote  #41 
Herman,

What has happened that makes you think the O'Rourke might have a BT mother instead of the Celeste?  This is news and very interesting.  You have a keen eye for figs, so something has made you think about this.

I've been under the impression that improved Celestes are not O'Rourkes, but the O'Rourke is the official improved Celeste of LSU.  Their tree has the three to five-lobed leaves.  All my improved Celestes have one-three-lobed leaves, but I saw a couple of five-lobed leaves on one of my definitely improved Celeste trees.  It was a Maher improved Celeste.

Supposedly, O'Rourke used the Hunt and regular Celestes as the mothers, but I suppose he could have tried other mothers.  If so, I wish he'd have noted that.  The Hunt and Celeste both are better in the rain and that's why they were used and O'Rourke was trying to improve the celestes for industrial crops.  It's all very interesting trying to figure all this out, isn't it?

A friend told me that his O'Rourke did real well in the rain we had last summer when other figs were split and soured.  He said it has a different flavor, as well, but it was good.  I got an air layer from him last week and another friend has given me a young O'Rourke he said is straight from LSU.

I saw Dalton's O'Rourke tree last season and it has leaves of all numbers, but mostly three to five lobes and the young trees he had for sale all had three to five lobes on them.

A couple of years ago, I bought what I thought was an O'Rourke from Dalton, but it had no leaves on it at the time.  It gets one to three-lobed leaves on it, mostly one-lobed.  It bore two figs last year and they were so delicious.  They didn't really look like iCs, though, so I don't know what to think.  I hope it bears more figs this year so I can study it.  Whatever it is, it's a keeper.

Improved Celestes are delicious figs and they keep on producing through the season.  The Maher iCs I have are very young trees, are good growers and even at a young age, they produced figs that were delicious, last year.  As the summer went on, they kept putting on figs and growing well.  When it was getting toward fall, I started picking off the figs and they were putting on more figs as fast as I could pick them off.  They did well over the winter and are leafing out well now and putting on brebas, which I've been picking off.  (Here we go, again.....)

The same goes for the Roy Young iCs.  If it will grow where you live, you can't go wrong with the iCs.

The figs that are shown on the link Petals from the Past look like they have a closed eye.  Do all O'Rourkes have closed eyes, then?  I wish they'd show the leaves, as well.

Thanks,

noss
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #42 
O"Rourke fig look like  Southern Brown Turkey,fruit leaves ,all match ,closed eye too,so it is like comparing a mother and a child,they have similar feature,that is why ,it is clearly,Dr O 'Rourke work to improve it.
Improved Celeste ,has features like Celeste,so it is an improvement on Celeste,this can be seen if one grow them side by side.
My take:Dr O'Rourke worked to improve all existent cultivars that proved to resist ,Southern climate conditions,with the idea to make them produce larger fruits,and he did get some good results.
Not perfect every time but some are very good indeed.
For ex: Improved Celeste is a superior fig compared to Regular Celeste,but for very demanding climates ,with a lot of rain like Louisiana,is not perfect as it have an eye that is a little more open than Regular Celeste,as it was taking some genes from the male caprifig,yet is much better ,than Celeste,here in my climate,because it does not drop any fruits.
noss

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Posted Reply with quote  #43 
Thank you, Herman.

I'm still looking for a Celeste that doesn't drop.  May be a futile hunt, I know.  The weather wasn't so hot and dry here back when I had my other Celestes, but they didn't drop their fruits.  That was in the late '60s through the '80s.

I had two of what seems like may have been Southern BTs.  The fruit was very small and they had little flavor and their eyes were not truly closed.  I got rid of them.  Maybe they weren't the real Southern BTs, though.  I got one as a BT and the other, as a TX Everbearing.  They did resemble the Celeste in color and even the leaves were similar.  Do they have to get older to taste good?  They did drop some figs in the heat/dry weather.  Since they couldn't hold a candle to my Celestes, I got rid of them.

What is a good source of the BT you have?  I could try one of those if I could get exactly what you have.

Thanks,

noss
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Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #44 
The Southern Brown Turkey in the above pix is from James Robin,and is very tasty.
The leaves and fruits are different,but the eye is just as closed as on a regular Celeste.
Look no farther ,James Robin has it.
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Posted Reply with quote  #45 
Herman2,
Just wanted to post pictures of my 2nd year improved Celeste one of the earliest ripening potted cultivars this season. All my potted figs got off to a late start, Southern Brown Turkey and Celeste have already produced a few ripe figs. This improved Celeste looks like it will ripen most of the figs that are currently on the tree (over 1 dozen were already pinched, but over 4 dozen are at the stagnant stage), even with our cold rainy summer this year and a late start to the season.
Note: this improved Celeste was from Petals... and labeled O'Rourke. My O'Rourke was also from Petals... and was labeled Tiger. I did  get an actual "Tiger" from Petals also, but it has not produced any figs as yet.
Thanks again for the recommendations.

<edit> 9/9/13... I picked two of the figs, they were not fully ripe, IMO they needed at least 2 more days.

Attached Images
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP_9-3-13.jpg (112.11 KB, 433 views)
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP_9-8-13.jpg (134.72 KB, 54 views)
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP1_9-8-13.jpg (133.36 KB, 64 views)
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP2_9-8-13.jpg (103.55 KB, 434 views)
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP3_9-8-13.jpg (156.67 KB, 438 views)
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP_9-9-13.jpg (59.34 KB, 47 views)
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP1_9-9-13.jpg (52.97 KB, 48 views)
jpeg FigS_Celeste_improvedCelestePP2_9-9-13.jpg (70.18 KB, 51 views)
Herman2

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Posted Reply with quote  #46 
Yes it is a good fig Pete,especially for us in cold climates,good for a base fig,and then, try others that are more difficult to grow and ripe.
Tam

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Posted Reply with quote  #47 
Thank you for posting very pretty photos. Can Herman2 or Pete please post the leaf photos of the Improved Celeste. Thank you.

Best,
Tam
ascpete

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Posted Reply with quote  #48 
Tam,
Attached are a few leaf pictures of the improved Celeste taken earlier in the year. There are additional photos posted under Celeste in the Fig of the Day Topic.  You're welcome.

If you look closely at the leaf nodes you will see the figlets forming. If you compare the dates on the photo to the dates on the photos above, you will notice that it took less than 70 days to harvest ripe figs from this cultivar, once the figlets had started to form.

[image]


[image]
Tam

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Posted Reply with quote  #49 
Hi! Pete,

Thank you for posting your Improved Celeste Photos. Dan in Louisiana said that Improve Celeste has mostly single-lobed leaves. Your tree has three-lobed leaves. I have 8 Celeste trees that I need to know if they are Improved Celeste or not. This photo is Dan's Improved Celeste. 




Best,
Tam
ascpete

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Posted Reply with quote  #50 
Tam,
You're welcome.
In Dan A's Posts and comments on improved Celeste, he has always specified
Quote:
Improved Celeste will have only single and trilobed leaves.....NEVER a five lobed leaf.

He has also mentioned the relationship of growth rate and lobe definition. The faster the growth rate the greater the lobe definition and sometimes quantity. Attached are pictures that he has posted of some of his improved Celeste, the comparison is not only of leaves, but also figs. Also there are differences due to culture, which should be considered.
[LSU_Improved_Celeste2]

[LSU+Improved+Celeste+%28main+crop%29]

[LSU+Improved+Celeste3+%2528main+crop%2529]

[LSU+Improved+Celeste4+%2528main+crop%2529]
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