Fig seeds sinking(viable?)

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Figgysid1

Registered:1413859653
Posts: 389

Posted 1447471701 · Edited	Reply with quote #1

I read a few posts that mentioned that viable seeds will sink and non-viable seeds will float. I just went out and collected some of my ripe figs that fell off and split, about 8 figs were on the ground around my hardy chicago fig pots they were very soft, over ripe. I mushed them up in a plastic bin filled with water and I noticed that about half the seeds floated but the other half sank to the bottom of the bin. I poured off the water and floating seeds and put the seeds that sank into a glass Pyrex measuring cup. Here is a picture of the seeds. Does anyone know what this means, did I do something wrong that made them sink? I guess I should just plant them and see what happens. :) Thanks for any insight into this. __________________ (Zone 12a) Big Island, Hawaii, 2,400 ft elevation, Fern Forest. Avg. July High 77,Avg.Jan.Low 56 Precipitation days 290, annual rainfall 201.80 inches.

figpig_66

Registered:1416870358
Posts: 2,678

Posted 1447474093	Reply with quote #2

Do you have the fig wasp?? This is the only way to have a pollenated seed __________________ RICHIE BONI HICKORY LOUISIANA ZONE 8B WARM HUMID WINRERS ARE VERY MILD LOW 20'S BUT WARMS RIGHT UP DURING THE DAY. SUMMER IS EXTREMELY HOT & HUMID 100 degrees 100% humidity fig tree grow like crazy but some split from rain & humidity Wish list. Col de dame blanc Col de rimada Lsu numbered figs

greenfig

Registered:1359790036
Posts: 3,182

Posted 1447475445	Reply with quote #3

My pollinated seeds sink too. Put them in a moist paper towel, place in a dish and cover with Saran Wrap . In a warm spot in about 2 weeks you should see the sprouts if the seeds were pollinated. __________________ wish list: Violeta, Calderona. USDA z 10a, SoCal

Figgysid1

Registered:1413859653
Posts: 389

Posted 1447476215	Reply with quote #4

I do have lots of tiny black wasps in my figs. But I don't think they are fig wasps. Even if they were, I thought they have to visit a male Capri fig 1st then bring the pollen into a female fig. I don't know why these sunk. I remember I put seeds in water before and all of them floated and they were hollow inside. @Greenfig Thanks I will try that method with the paper towel. __________________ (Zone 12a) Big Island, Hawaii, 2,400 ft elevation, Fern Forest. Avg. July High 77,Avg.Jan.Low 56 Precipitation days 290, annual rainfall 201.80 inches.

jdsfrance

Registered:1376988473
Posts: 2,591

Posted 1447513623	Reply with quote #5

Hi Figgysid1, This is just normal for me. Check my thread on pollination myth kill. The theory as it that those seeds are generated per parthenocarpy. The egg did duplicate its genes to generate a complete seed. I have 4 growing, 1 I seeded in a pot ( lost the 10 others) and 3 that volunteered in the garden just this year. Two stayed small, but the third is in between of 1' and 2' of height. The theory as it, that those seedlings could all be smyrna type because of lack of pollination ... Time will tell. Winter may interfere though ... One thing is sure, old people in a non-wasp zone I know, often referred to those seedlings as "worthless mâle figs", for the reason that most/?all? of those trees would never bear fruits for them. Oh well, I want to know/test by myself ... If I have patience. I know it takes an apple seedling at least 5 seasons to fruit ... I'm not sure that I'll wait that time for a fig tree when my good documented fig trees sucker as they do ! My higher volunteer is under my 'healthy longue d'aout" and so far the leaves do almost match the ones of the mother ... __________________ ------------------------ Climate from -25°C to + 35°C Only cold hardy figtrees can make it here

Figgysid1

Registered:1413859653
Posts: 389

Posted 1447525027	Reply with quote #6

@ Jdsfrance: Thanks for the link to your post. I am not sure if the wasps, even if they are the wrong type could have brought some mulberry pollen or other pollen into the figs and it could have tricked the fig into think it was pollinated like is mentioned in this post on apomixis. http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/use-of-induced-apomixis-in-the-breeding-of-figs-7216971 I hope that if they sprout they will be all male capri figs since that is what I am looking for, a persistent male capri fig. I have read a few topics that mention the desire for people in colder northern zones to have a cold hardy, mount etna type, persistent male capri for a breeding program and possibly crossing it with desert king to make the ultimate cold hardy fig. I think it may be worth the effort, just for the irony, of doing a fig breeding program for the world's most cold hardy fig variety "In Hawaii". :) __________________ (Zone 12a) Big Island, Hawaii, 2,400 ft elevation, Fern Forest. Avg. July High 77,Avg.Jan.Low 56 Precipitation days 290, annual rainfall 201.80 inches.

Figgysid1

Registered:1413859653
Posts: 389

Posted 1448941199	Reply with quote #7

Update today. I got 3 seedlings to sprout from those seeds so far. I did not plant them well, I just tossed them into some pots. Here they are 3 hardy chicago seedlings. I am not sure what this means or what they will turn into but I will let them grow a bit then up-pot them. __________________ (Zone 12a) Big Island, Hawaii, 2,400 ft elevation, Fern Forest. Avg. July High 77,Avg.Jan.Low 56 Precipitation days 290, annual rainfall 201.80 inches.

hoosierbanana

Registered:1287901146
Posts: 2,186

Posted 1448948196 · Edited	Reply with quote #8

Hey Sid, apparently the following species have their pollinator wasp in Hawaii: F. religiosa, F. benghalensis, F. microcarpa, and F cf. platypoda. So it seems like you could have either interspecific hybrid or apomictic seeds, that is pretty cool either way and a real adventure! __________________ 7a, DE

Figgysid1

Registered:1413859653
Posts: 389

Posted 1448949527	Reply with quote #9

@hoosierbanana: That's probably most likely. Another type of fig wasp is bringing pollen into these and pollinating them. So far looks like it's just the hardy chicago that is getting pollinated. The fruits look much darker black, and deep red on the inside like I just posted in "hardy chicago hawaii". Also they taste completely different. I can see why people would prefer pollinated figs, darker color sweeter richer taste. I think it has happened before since a ficus pumila X carica hybrid was found by chance in a botanical garden I think. So a wasp from one of the ficus would have had to go into the wrong fig and pollinate it. __________________ (Zone 12a) Big Island, Hawaii, 2,400 ft elevation, Fern Forest. Avg. July High 77,Avg.Jan.Low 56 Precipitation days 290, annual rainfall 201.80 inches.

hoosierbanana

Registered:1287901146
Posts: 2,186

Posted 1448952473 · Edited	Reply with quote #10

This happening with HC could be the key to a fig mystery. If they are apomictic it could give a clue as to whether Etna figs are all originally from the same seedling (lots of variation) or very similar seedlings from a wild population (not as much variation compared to apomictic seeds of other varieties). __________________ 7a, DE

gorgi

Registered:1188888396
Posts: 2,864

Posted 1448963269	Reply with quote #11

I think that the theory is that (depending on the seed kind), viable seeds are 'full & heavy', and tend to sink in water (e.g., tomatoes). I use this method to 'clean' (both seeds & chaff off) using a tall clear container by repetitively draining the top floating parts. Some other (light/fluffy) seed-kinds tend to always float (e.g., marigold). __________________ George, NJ_z7a.

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