Encanto Farms Nursery > Categories > ID help please...this one is different

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FMD

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I had a visitor yesterday while working in the garden tending my  figs.

I have a pretty good idea of who she is but would like confirmation from someone more familiar with reptiles.

When I first saw her she had a mouthful of frog but swallowed quickly to better make her getaway. What a beautiful specimen!

By the way, we are near water.


go4broek

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I'ma going with this fella http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=water+moccasins&view=detail&id=0D6D06F650539D4AB7C3C53F7D31400CBA728569&first=0

Rut roh!

hoosierbanana

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Yeah, look at the diamond head in the first shot. Also, it did not seem very afraid of you. I have never seen one, but caught a copperhead when I was a kid without knowing what it was. That SOB yawned and I was like WOW, THOSE ARE BIG FANGS! What was I thinking?

genecolin

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Looks like you got yourself more that a water moccasin, you have yourself a CottonMouth Moccasin. One of the few poisonous snakes in the south, especially near water. They are not afraid of you and will attack you if you come close. Steer clear or dispatch.
"gene"

FMD

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I'm pretty sure it was NOT a water moccasin based on a couple of things.

She was by no means aggressive. The first thing she did to was to slither under some black plastic and curl up. When prodded, she quickly made her getaway. I didn't get too close, but could not see any large pits on her snout nor cotton in her mouth. I think it was a black/brown water snake. These snakes also have an arrow shaped head, but are non poisonous. Earlier in the day I saw an even bigger one but didn't have my camera. Spring time in Tallahassee!

Here's one I found in google images:


jtp

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Sure looks like a cottonmouth to me. Check the eyes. If it has a round pupil, then it is a non-venomous water snake. If the eye is a slit, best stay away from it because it is a mocc. Beautiful but deadly. And it might have not been aggressive because you caught it dining. Be careful, they like to get up into trees as well.

Gina

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The head in the first pic sure is triangular looking. Better to be extra careful than sorry with a wrong ID.

 

We have rattlers here (and gopher and king snakes) and they do take away some of the carefree aspects of gardening.

FMD

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Just spoke with a couple of people at work who know snakes and they vote for.... mocassin.

I hate when that happens.


nelson20vt

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Im glad I live in Canada for once lol.

paulandirene

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I grew up and live in rattlesnake country. I don't mind them around [most of the time] because they want to stay out of your way and give you as much warning as possible. However, from what I have heard, Cottonmouth/Water Moccasin are more aggressive.


Per the head and body shape, I'd say your co-workers are right. As to why it wasn't aggressive...having a mouthful of frog [and thus unable to use its fangs for protection] might explain that. 

rhopkins

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I can tell you without a doubt that is a Cottonmouth-Water Moccasin.  I see them all to often.  It is a pit-viper as others have said the head and eyes give it away.  I don't mess with those snakes they get the hoe.  Very aggressive and deadly.  Wish you'd had distroyed that snake...  The water snake would have a long slinder head. Be careful in that enviorment where they are boss.

jtp

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Watch where you step. If there is one, there may be more. One summer when I was home from college, I worked at a lumber yard. We used to find the cottonmouth babies under boards. They'd snap right at our steel-toed boots. Not more than 5 inches long but they really had no fear.

 

We've got them here in NC, as well as copperheads and rattlesnakes. Love the state and its climate, not a fan of the snakes though. I always do a quick scan of the yard before my son plays. Better safe.

Fredfig

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 To me it is the very common, Red Belly/banded Water snake.
All I could see was the head shape, but not the coloration around eyes/face. They will bite you. One struck me in the Suwanee river/ Panhandle of Fla. Like getting scratched badly by Greenbriars / Smilex. Not poison.
   But, unless you truly know your snakes, be careful.
 Fredfig

BronxFigs

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Sometimes, and not very often, I'm glad I live in New York City!  The snakes here have two legs.  They've evolved.

Frank

nelson20vt

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Lmao frank those 2 legged snakes are just as venomous.

Chapman

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I vote for a Cottonmouth.  The picture with it's head tells you it's a poisonous snake. That's a good sized one, be very careful around them.

noss

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That snake looks short and stocky to me and so are water moccasins.  The head looks very triangular, as well.  About what was the length of this snake?

As for the eyes, I wouldn't get close enough to look at the eyes of any snake with a triangular head.  If it's got a triangular head, I'm going to beat feet away from it.

If you have a long enough stick, next time you see it, make it strike at the stick and you'll know if it has a white mouth inside.  (Not.)

I'm not for indiscriminately killing snakes, but poisonous ones would have to go.

Gina, you're so lucky to have gopher and king snakes.  I never see larger snakes around here, only little ones.  Once I was moving a brush pile out front and when I lifted of a section of it, a little snake came out striking and acting all big and bad--all 6", of it, if even that.  I pinned it down with the grass rake and took a good look.  It was a little hog-nosed snake and was huffing and puffing, loaded for bear.  They are so funny.  They rear up and flare like cobras almost.  It was so cute.  I picked it up and the first thing it did was poop all over my hand and that really stank.  I took it to the back yard and let it go out there.

I went and googled the snakes and the other snakes mentioned had heads that were a little wider at the back than the front, but not that sharply-defined head like on your snake.  Yours looks like it has that fierce look of poisonous snakes.  The others had round eyes that were closer to the nose than yours looks, plus, one place said the Florida moccasin is the darkest of all and the moccasin found in NC is the largest, with the Western moccasin being the smallest of them.  Your snake looks dark.  Also, they usually don't get over 6' in length, but they will look larger because of their thick bodies.

Your snake may have wanted to get away having just eaten a frog.  They take awhile to swallow their prey and aren't in the best form for defending themselves at that time.

The articles all said that the moccasin has the reputation of being aggressive, but that was not true and if they think they can get away, that will be their first choice, but if cornered, they will defend themselves.  If there is water nearby, they will head for it if they think they can get away and have slithered right past, or over people's feet going toward the water, but are not attacking.  Don't know about that, as any time we've been out fishing, we were the ones going the other direction. 

noss

hoosierbanana

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I am going to have to change my answer to brown water snake, check out this picture.


hoosierbanana

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Better picture with no wierdos in it.


FMD

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Brent, that's pretty damned scary!

Why'd you have go and post a picture of Carrot Top so early in the morning?




Right back at you,


FMD

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Seriously, though.....


Here's my first brown water snake/cottonmouth from more than 10 years ago when I was clearing the area of brush. 


I don't know, even though I live in Florida under the  (in my opinion...barbaric), 'Stand Your Ground'  law, I have misgivings about killing any snake, including a cottonmouth. Any creature that gives humans the willies gains my  respect in more ways than one.

jtp

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Wow! Carrot Top must have gotten bitten. Look how swollen he looks. Sorry, couldn't help it. The man looks like the love child of Ronald McDonald and the Hulk.

 

I'm no fan of killing snakes either. They serve a purpose. But if it is venomous, getting rid of it would be necessary to ensure safety in my yard. And I'm not scooping it up into a bucket for relocation.

hoosierbanana

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Sorry Frank, I bet that snake was scared too. I would call for a rescue if I saw a Carrot Top. They are native to Florida so be careful!

rhopkins

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Well, I showed the two pics to a guy that milks poisonous snakes routinely.  He says no doubt in his mind you have a fine looking Cottonmouth on your property.  He said as others have written, if that snake had just not eaten lunch, he would have showed you some of his other talents!  He mainly milks rattler's but he has two cottonmouths and he, like the nut he is, said he would have sure like to have caught that one...   I Guess I should be thankful someone likes to do that job so we have snake anti-venom available when we need it.  I sure hope you own a hoe or a 22.  We have so many problems with snakes and with the light winter we had they are plentiful this year.  Copperhead's are first on our list followed by timber-rattler's.  YUCK to all of them!

noss

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I think the guy is kinda cute.  He's sure cuter than that picture of Carrot Top, if that's who the small photo is.  Why do people want to go around with their pants falling off like that?  Now THAT'S real scary to me.

I still think your snake is a moccasin, FMD, so be careful.  I hope it turns out to be a water snake, but its neck is skinnier and the jaws look wider, but it's not a real clear photo of its head.

The pictures I saw of moccasins all looked so different, but the articals said they can be all patterns and colors.  The moccasins I've seen here are very dark.  Mike almost stepped on one lakeside when we were fishing with the kids.  The good thing is it was quite cool that morning and Mike froze then stepped slowly away from it and we went to fish elsewhere after we all got a good look at it, from a distance.

noss

FMD

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I was joking about the red headed "weirdo" being Carrot Top, but it actually is the real Carrot Top. Link below:

http://www.aaanimalcontrol.com/blog/carrottop.html


More interesting however is what the animal control guy had to say about the snake and Carrot Top. 


Excerpts:

[QUOTE]As usual, the customer thought that it was a venomous snake, and in this case, the appearance was actually close to the dangerous cottonmouth. However, it was in fact a non-venomous Brown Water Snake. All aquatic snakes are heavy-bodied like the cottonmouth, and often do look similar. This was a nice specimen. It was also very aggressive, striking at every opportunity."


"Carrot Top was not keen on getting close to the snake, but did manage this one photograph. He's been hitting the gym quite a bit lately, but his bulky muscles offered no protection against the natural fear of snakes.

[/QUOTE]

paully22

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Used to live in the boonies and have killed many venomous snakes as a kid gathering firewood for mum. The small ones like the size of dew worms are so hard to spot in wood piles. I remember as a kid I was baby sitting my sis who was less than a year old and mum ran from the kitchen to the front entrance with a stick. I was sitting on floor with sis in my arms and this big black snake slitter  pass me very fast. I asked mum why she never shout about the snake. She said, she did not want to spook  me when little sis was in my arms. I was 7 yrs old.

Snakes was a bad problem and not sure whether it works or not, mum would lined the house sides with sulphur often to ward off snakes. We keep geese like watch dogs for snakes.There were so many around & we kill them because of safety issues. Many times we have to call uncle or neighbours to flush snakes out from the house.

I have seen some huge fat King cobras that are at least over 8ft long while fishing in streams. I stay away from the big ones unless I have a shotgun.

noss

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Carrot Top looks a whole lot better in the large photo than in the small one.  Didn't realize they were the same person.  He should still pull up his pants--

Pants on the ground, pants on the ground--Lookin' like a fool with his pants on the ground.  I don't guess people are embarrassed at losing their pants anymore?

noss

paully22

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Noss, eagle eyes. ha ha ha. Imagine if David(Animal Removal) had dropped the snake at Carrot Top, he would likely lose his pants that is barely on.

musillid

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Perhaps if while at the gym he worked on his gluteus muscles, he'd have something with which to hold up his pants.

noss

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Paully,

Now that's a picture!  He'd come right out of them and would be too scared to notice.  ROTF!!!

Dale,

He could use a good pair of suspenders.

noss

saxonfig

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Hey Frank. Your "visitor" in post #1 is definitely not a Cotton Mouth/Water Moccasin (agkistrodon piscivorous) . It is most likely a FL Banded water snake (Nerodia fasciata pictiventris) . Frogs are a favorite food.  


The pics you provided in the later post are the real deal though. One of the best quick identifiers is that horizontal dark stripe that runs down the side of the Cotton Mouth's face. It usually runs from the back of the jaw and on up through the eye. The Cotton Mouth also has venom glands on each side of the head giving it's head a slightly wider and thicker build than most other water snakes.

The snake you saw was also likely not a Brown Water snake. I've handled all three above mentioned varieties at one time or another when I lived in S FL. It's important to note that I did not handle the Cotton Mouths with my bare hands though. A 3' pair of snake tongs came in very handy in those instances ;) . I had the privilege of seeing some real monster sized Water Moccasins in the FL Everglades. But those are snake stories for another forum.

By the way, I could have gone the rest of my life without seeing Carrot Top nearly losing his shorts. In the spirit of Jeff Dunham's Walter - 'Pull up your dang shorts ya Moron!' LOL!      

hoosierbanana

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Bad decision on my part. My eyes must have been blurry from waking up early. I am sorry you all had to see Carrot Top. He's like that lady that tried to turn herself into a cat for her (ex)husband. No picture provided.

Thanks for the ID Bill.

FMD

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Hey guys, thanks for all the input.

I'm just glad no one identified it as a Brown Turkey.  :))


satellitehead

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Are you sure that's not a Brown Turkey?  Water Cotton Brown Turkey, maybe?

FMD

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 [QUOTE] Are you sure that's not a Brown Turkey? [/QUOTE]


Sadly, the snake would probably come out ahead in a taste contest..


"Ah yes, crunchy, with a hint of frog and definitely snakey"


satellitehead

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Hey man, I ate goat, chicken hearts, cow tongue and crickets for lunch today, I'd still rather eat that or a snake than I'd eat a Brown Turkey.