Okay, let the fireworks fly.  I've spent too much time already trying to figure out what is going on and consulting with other F4F members who suspect the same scam going on and, for the protection of people who are a little too trustworthy, I have decided to reveal what seems to be going on.

The recent F4F member abcd has made some interesting posts, appearing to be a newbie fig collector, offering to buy cuttings from others.  In the original post, abcd indicates they have had trouble rooting cuttings and would like to buy more cuttings to keep experimenting.  See http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=7219709 Also, quite interestingly, claiming to have imported Greek fig cuttings released which were released by USDA contrary to very clear regulations that prohibit this.  See http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=7228699

I and others have sold significant quantities of cuttings to abcd, or Alex Gulenok, of River Edge, NJ.  Specifically, I sold Alex 25 cuttings of Panache and 25 cuttings of UCR 184-15 and he received them last Wednesday (January 7th).  I and others are 99% certain that Alex sells under the eBay ID of 2014.gulen (partial name match, same city).

Alex also just recently posted on F4F asking for a source of starter Jolly Tiger plants.  See http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=7234410

The eBay 2014.gulen account was created in October 2014 and has a history of selling 9 varieties of figs in the past month and currently has 21 auctions listed with 9 varieties in addition to those showing up in feedback history of being sold previously. An auction for 184-15 was also active yesterday but apparently someone already purchased those cuttings.  Current listings include Jolly Tiger which is particularly interesting as Alex was just looking for starter plants four days ago and now has cuttings being offered.  See http://www.ebay.com/itm/251789211493 for the current Jolly Tiger listing.  I strongly suspect the striped fig cuttings shown are the Panache cuttings I shipped to Alex last week.

I suspect Alex also uses the eBay account svet_vasyl-2008 which also has a listing for Jolly Tiger with many of the same photos being used.  There was another auction in the Buy It Now format that apparently got sold already.  See http://www.ebay.com/itm/321640705172 for the current listing for suckers.

I and others have suspicions of connections with other eBay accounts but evidence in incomplete.  Maybe Alex (abcd) would like to provide the details.

If you've been the buyer of cuttings from suspicious sellers in the northeast, please send me a PM with details.

I have saved PDF copies of the threads linked above in case they are deleted by abcd.

EDIT- See posts where I have made significant updates at:
http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/show_single_post?pid=1285794538&postcount=99
http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post/show_single_post?pid=1285806763&postcount=109

I suggest avoiding any activity with the following eBay users:

2014.gulen
atskor10 (formerly atskor8) *
korina-2009 *
korina77-2008 *
svet_vasyl-2008 *

* It's been confirmed that these eBay users use the same PayPal account.  See post #109 linked above.

Edit 1/17: It appears that eBay user 77peony of Moscow, PA is probably also part of this group.

Also, if anyone has a desire to read a cached copy of abcd's thread before some posts were deleted, it can temporarily be found at http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:b6ep9rzRrXsJ:www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post%3Fid%3D7229696%26goto%3Dnextnewest+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

Edit 1/18: It appears with 99% certainty that radyslava is another eBay account being used by abcd (Alex Gulenok).

Edit 4/28:  In an effort to edude detection, these scammers continue to change their IDs.  Also, another related account was identified.  As of now, the list of eBay accounts used by this group consist of the following:
200rarefigtrees
77peony
korina-2009
korina77-2008
vasyl_svet
vasyus4
growgr.55
radyslava

I'm afraid figs have become big business with so many selling to for top prices, and with cutting you don't know for a year or more if you have been scammed..... it seem obvious there is a recent rash of scammers coming out of the woodwork. 

It hard to buy from ebay anymore and feel confident. So now i look if they are on figs for fun and check how long they have been a member and read there postings. This is my new safer way after the other thing i just went through. Thanks mr.C

[QUOTE=HarveyC]Okay, let the fireworks fly.  I've spent too much time already trying to figure out what is going on and consulting with other F4F members who suspect the same scam going on and, for the protection of people who are a little too trustworthy, I have decided to reveal what seems to be going on.

The recent F4F member abcd has made some interesting posts, appearing to be a newbie fig collector, offering to buy cuttings from others.  In the original post, abcd indicates they have had trouble rooting cuttings and would like to buy more cuttings to keep experimenting.  See http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=7219709 Also, quite interestingly, claiming to have imported Greek fig cuttings released which were released by USDA contrary to very clear regulations that prohibit this.  See http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=7228699

I and others have sold significant quantities of cuttings to abcd, or Alex Gulenok, of River Edge, NJ.  Specifically, I sold Alex 25 cuttings of Panache and 25 cuttings of UCR 184-15 and he received them last Wednesday (January 7th).  I and others are 99% certain that Alex sells under the eBay ID of 2014.gulen (partial name match, same city).

Alex also just recently posted on F4F asking for a source of starter Jolly Tiger plants.  See http://www.figs4funforum.websitetoolbox.com/post?id=7234410

The eBay 2014.gulen account was created in October 2014 and has a history of selling 9 varieties of figs in the past month and currently has 21 auctions listed with 9 varieties in addition to those showing up in feedback history of being sold previously. An auction for 184-15 was also active yesterday but apparently someone already purchased those cuttings.  Current listings include Jolly Tiger which is particularly interesting as Alex was just looking for starter plants four days ago and now has cuttings being offered.  See http://www.ebay.com/itm/251789211493 for the current Jolly Tiger listing.  I strongly suspect the striped fig cuttings shown are the Panache cuttings I shipped to Alex last week.

I suspect Alex also uses the eBay account svet_vasyl-2008 which also has a listing for Jolly Tiger with many of the same photos being used.  There was another auction in the Buy It Now format that apparently got sold already.  See http://www.ebay.com/itm/321640705172 for the current listing for suckers.

I and others have suspicions of connections with other eBay accounts but evidence in incomplete.  Maybe Alex (abcd) would like to provide the details.

If you've been the buyer of cuttings from suspicious sellers in the northeast, please send me a PM with details.

I have saved PDF copies of the threads linked above in case they are deleted by abcd.[/QUOTE]

SOB's in NJ
Criminals everyone of them...

:)

now, now, Richard...LOL

Seriously though...(I need some water tidiest all this).
Harvey, that's a lot of work from your part just to worn us, thanks in my behalf.
But... although the way the cuttings were attained doesn't sound very honest, at least they are not FALSE varieties, right? I mean, you said it that you sold him and he or she, looked for a true source for other varieties...
The only thing that bothers me is that this person didn't come out clean about his intentions and (maybe) took advantage of soft hearted follow forum members to make some bucks off of them, ugh... where is that water!

Not quite, Aaron.  Read my original post again.  I believe my Panache fig cuttings are being sold as Jolly Tiger.  I also suspect that the 18 or more varieties that this seller has sold or is trying to sell may mostly be mislabeled intentionally.

He purchased some of my unknowns. (2 varieties). I did not have any problem.

NJ The real Fig Mafia... Anywhere else .... just a glorified crew

There are those who steal to eat, and there are criminals. Hope you were hungry Alex. Your kids will be very proud of you!

Harvey, thanks for the research and heads up.  There may be another one close at hand as well.  Cons are good at what they do.

[QUOTE=HarveyC]Not quite, Aaron.  Read my original post again.  I believe my Panache fig cuttings are being sold as Jolly Tiger.  I also suspect that the 18 or more varieties that this seller has sold or is trying to sell may mostly be mislabeled intentionally.[/QUOTE]ok, I trust your judgement and if this is what your are telling us you saw him list,,, mismatches then I, seriously, think you should report him Harvey. Starting with eBay then to some other agents...higher up.
oh, this is BAD!!!

Aaron, I already talked to eBay about this the other day.  They said their risk management team would look into it.  They are only interested if it might cost them some money.  Trying to find other authorities that might be interested would be difficult.

Seems to me that anyone buying 25 cuttings of any one cultivar all at once should at least raise an eyebrow.  I have 2 cuttings of some cultivars and hope to get one tree, 8 cuttings of others and I'm not sure what I'm going to do with all of them when they are trees.  And that's just 8!!!

how about if you approach the entire case as a Fraud and Con-artistry. He's telling them one thing yet sending them another.
Con-artistry is criminal!

Scott, LOL
really, I just killed my 2 precious Clown FIG CUTTING, CAN YOU SPARE ME 25 PLEASE? I'm just trying to merely replace them.

Thanks Harvey for the heads up. I will try not to buy any this time.

He has a lot of auctions listed.

[QUOTE=Aaron4USA]Scott, LOL
really, I just killed my 2 precious Clown FIG CUTTING, CAN YOU SPARE ME 25 PLEASE? I'm just trying to merely replace them.[/QUOTE]

 
Aaron, why stop at 25? Push it on up to 50, what does that make your odds? My luck, with just 2 I'll screw it up, with 25 they will all root, Murphy's law right. 

Good job Harvey! Thanks for the heads up! All members need to be a little more careful when it comes to trades and -or sales that are based on a single photo or promise without the proper back up! Stay calm( do not let a flashy pic excite you), be patient and think twice before you offer all you do or do not have! With all the reliable members growing almost every variety within this forum ,I do not see the reason for any of us to look on unproven sellers elsewhere for our buys!

I have,done a good bit of trading but happened to be older members i think. I better go check.

The majority of trusted EBay sellers are F4F members anyway, if you are looking for something just ask.  Really it's the people that have not been fortunate enough to find F4F that are being victimised.  If members choose to buy from a seller without checking into them here, then that is on them. 

As far as buying cuttings from a member at a discount then reselling them at a profit, to me that is stealing and dishonest unless disclosed in advance. 

That is very unfortunate that people take advantage of kind hearted individuals. I really just takes one to mess it up for everyone else.

The other day when I was reading through the threads - I too found it very suspicious when I saw that he has a broker who supposedly has the ability to produce papers that allow the import of the Greek figs.

abcd..."Where for art thou Romeo"?

He.s back tracking deleting his old post.

Thank you Harvey, for bringing this matter up. When I offered cuttings of Osborne Prolific to members a couple of weeks ago for just the shipping cost, I was contacted quickly by abcd. He asked for 3 packages. I thought that was odd, but maybe newbie exuberence. I sent him 2, and he paid the shipping. Soon I noticed O P cuttings offered on ebay, by the seller 2014.gulen. Quite a coincidence that this seller is in River Edge, N.J., same as abcd.

So sad.  So tired of reading about people getting ripped off. 

Me too. I got scammed but dont want to hear about but we all need to. I am new member and was really enjoying it then all the sudden ebay got it then now going here. Sad day for figs : (

Thank-you for your efforts in exposing this. His thread about the greek fig/import papers, smelled fishy enough for me to want to avoid him here. But I (or others) maybe would have dealt with him on Ebay, not knowing the connection. I think you gathered strong enough evidence before outing him, and him backtracking his posts adds to your case. Thank-you again.

Regards,
billy

hello everyone.
i have to go with Harvey on this one.
this abcd person wanted me to sell him some cuttings.
i caught him lying to me... and that was that!!!

His screen name was good enough for me not to trust him... ABCD??? Atleast put some effort into it...

I've been here over a year and cant get 1 Panache. New guy comes in and walks away with 25. LOL. Guess I am doing something wrong..
Thanks for the heads up. I can go buy one of his jolly tigers and know its really a Panache.
Just kidding of course. I wont support someone who is dishonest. Hopefully UCD or John will come through this year..

Jeff I should be running into some 2-3 feet tall Panache pretty soon, let me know if you want me to buy it and send it to you. I am going to see some private tree nurseries in a few weeks.

WOW!!! great ending to a great story!!! 
best of luck with your sales.

Thanks for the detective work, Harvey.

Funny enough, abcd told me someone was selling him hundreds of Celeste cuttings for 50 cents each... I wonder what they are sell as on eBay. I have no problem with anyone selling anything they got legally, but saying they are something they are not is the problem.

Great work, Harvey.  It stinks that there are some people that take advantage of the community.  It makes you think twice before gifting cuttings anymore.
Nothing wrong with selling cuttings/trees of your own.  It's HOW you do it.

Don't let that 1 bad fig ruin the whole tree.
starting my very first cutting today ,Dominicks sweet Diana 
will post if any luck with them..

I was going to write a page of information.  But Harvey as the facts and I don't need to add anymore.  Nice work Harvey bringing this to everyone's attention.  Good job!

Selling a cutting as one variety but it is in reality another variety is morally wrong.  Thanks for the heads up.

But legitimately buying large quantities of cuttings with the intention of re-selling (anywhere) is called business. That is what nurseries do.

I'm looking for 50-100 cuttings of VdB cheap for eventual re-sale as plants, how is this wrong?  Anyone providing me with them will have to know they are for future sales, right? 

Lots of scumbags on ebay.  Thanks Harvey.

You know what's interesting is there was another thread about someone in PA being tied to someone in NJ.  I think it was the Korina something or another ebayer.  And I recall someone saying the person sent a really mean and bigoted response to them.  The response seemed to read a lot like abcd's response above.  Maybe another link?  Just sayin!
Timothy

Oh yeah...the situation in this thread seems sketchy.  There's no way to frame it that could look good.

Okay my memory was a little fuzzy.  Apparently I crossed a couple stories in my mind but here are the details.
ediblelandscaping.sc had this quote:[QUOTE]New message from: korina77-2008 

To Jeff looking for the Panache, you can always get a nice sized tree from Bill's Figs in Flemington NJ. I think they are $35. Not sure if he ships however.

As to the criminal enterprise, it's hard to fathom. If you have this much criminal talent wouldn't it be more profitable to work in a different criminal enterprise? That's a lot of work for not that much money ... ?

[QUOTE=abcd]

As per selling on eBay, yes, I got proposition from few members to help them to sell cuttings on eBay. Do not ask me why, may be because some afraid of “fig police”, do not want to bother, or have no time – but what is wrong with the fact that members want to make some $$ for many reasons- to pay bills or who cares what. Do they need approval from anybody – probably not?  

Tell me what is wrong with this picture. By the way, many of you selling on eBay, good luck, who cares, surly you are not afraid of competition. 

Oh, WOW!!! Thanks Harvey.

As a new member on the forum I feel as though I am at a historic Witch Burning. This is great information and hopefully can save a lot of forum members a lot of lost time and money.  Personally I have not felt comfortable enough yet to either buy or trade anything fig related on line.  All of my present fig collection has come from Bills Figs in Flemington because I like to see the mother tree and get advice about how it stands up to the New Jersey climate. As a matter of fact just this year I wanted to buy one of his Panache trees and although he had some, he didn't recommend it for our climate [something that you can't get on line].  Even after a short time as a member I think people on this forum are for the most part dedicated and honest fig lovers and sometimes you just have to go with your gut feeling and buyer or seller Beware.

I think your right Joe, and it was a gut feeling that got Harvey and I talking and then he talked to others....I think it is important as a community that we look out for each other. So when I notice something hinky I will say something and some times seek the advice of others to see if they noticed anything either.
I hope that this makes us a better group and helps new people not get suckered and then soured on growing figs.